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To: Quester
I am adressing the point that John the apostle seems to think that we can know that we have eternal life, ... something you seem to think is above our pay-grade.

If we are honestly following all of the commandments (and not deluding ourselves about that, I might add) then we can be reasonably sure that we "know" we are saved, if we die at that point.

To think that this is because one day we said "I believe" is incorrect. We can know this if we to the things we are suppsoed to do. And we know this as long as we do do those things.

If we cease to do those things, then our sincerity from day one is in doubt.

It is not the mouthing of the words, or the one-time committment, but the every day journey. Always.

If one has to endure in anything, it would be belief, for belief is the qualification that scripture puts forth for salvation.

That is called begging the question. We saw right above it says "believe and love one another." Not just "believe."

BElief is necessary, yes. And if you want to consider it a foundation stone, a sine qua non of salvation, that is jsut fine. I agree.

But to say that it is everything is simply wrong. Yes, faith leads to our good works, but it is not the same thing.

When I set out to become a world class runner, I can trace my victory in the olympics to the day I set out to first run. But I did not win just because of that one day determination. No, I won because I let that determination flower into action and I stuck with it.

And, once again, what, besides faith (belief) is there for Christians to endure in ?

Following Jesus' example. Day in and day out

SD

52,471 posted on 05/08/2003 2:39:22 PM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: SoothingDave
To think that this is because one day we said "I believe" is incorrect. We can know this if we to the things we are suppsoed to do. And we know this as long as we do do those things.

If we cease to do those things, then our sincerity from day one is in doubt.

It is not the mouthing of the words, or the one-time committment, but the every day journey. Always.


I agree. Genuine belief will chart our course.

That is called begging the question. We saw right above it says "believe and love one another." Not just "believe."

Belief is necessary, yes. And if you want to consider it a foundation stone, a sine qua non of salvation, that is just fine. I agree.


I would say further that genuine belief will bring about whatever else God might desire from us.

When I set out to become a world class runner, I can trace my victory in the olympics to the day I set out to first run. But I did not win just because of that one day determination. No, I won because I let that determination flower into action and I stuck with it.

But God doesn't ask that we become world class runners (through our own efforts). How many persons could become world class runners (through their own efforts). Could you ?

God merely asks that we place our hand in His and walk with Him. If, at some point, we find ourselves making a world class run, it will be because of Him (our hand being in His), not because of us.

52,484 posted on 05/08/2003 3:00:38 PM PDT by Quester
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