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To: Lurking Libertarian
Of course, each fossil is a "fully functional, integrated organism"; that's exactly what evolution predicts. It has to be to stay alive and pass on its genes to the next generation.

Where are the duds? The transitional forms with half-developed eyes? Half-developed nervous systems, etc.?

Punk-eek speaks of evolution as happening relatively quickly, in geologic time-- e.g., over tens of thousands of years rather than the hundreds of thousands predicted by classical darwinism-- not all in one generation.

And how is this is different from differentiation by small mutation?

And a mutation doesn't have to occur in both a male and a female; if one of them has it, half their offspring will have it, and if it confers a reproductive advantage, more of the next generation will have it, and so on.

Not if it's a giant step. Either you have variation by small mutation which would result in a fossil record full of transitional duds, or you have variation by large mutation which necessitates the simultaneous, spontaneous, miraculous appearance of both a male and female of the same new species.

371 posted on 03/15/2002 11:36:39 AM PST by Aquinasfan
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To: Aquinasfan
Where are the duds? The transitional forms with half-developed eyes? Half-developed nervous systems, etc.?

This is getting pathetic. Every degree of visual sensor and nervous system are present in existing species today.

You're an example what happens when someone gets all his science from pamphlets.

374 posted on 03/15/2002 11:42:58 AM PST by VadeRetro
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To: Aquinasfan
Where are the duds? The transitional forms with half-developed eyes? Half-developed nervous systems, etc.?

What is a half-developed eye? Your skin is a half-developed eye in that it can sense light but does not resolve an image. Some single-celled critters can detect light, and simple invertebrates such as brine shrimp have eye spots that also just detect light. Farther up the scale are the arthropod eyes that can detect shades of light and movement. Then you've got eyes that can resolve only black and white, or some colors. But then again, you've got insect eyes which can resolve colors well into the ultraviolet end of the spectrum. What do you consider a half-developed eye?

As for half-developed nervous systems, what would you consider that to be? Would it be the stimulus-response receptors found on jelly-fish, the non-centralized nervous system of the starfish, the ganglia-controlled stimulus-response system of insects? You need to be a little clearer.

375 posted on 03/15/2002 11:53:24 AM PST by Junior
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To: Aquinasfan
And how is this is different from differentiation by small mutation?

It isn't, and that's the point.

376 posted on 03/15/2002 11:54:09 AM PST by Junior
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To: Aquinasfan
Not if it's a giant step. Either you have variation by small mutation which would result in a fossil record full of transitional duds, or you have variation by large mutation which necessitates the simultaneous, spontaneous, miraculous appearance of both a male and female of the same new species.

I don't think you are quite getting this. There is no giant, spontaneous leap from one species to the next. It is a gradual movement of the entire population over many, many generations. Any really badly adapted critters die off and the well-adapted critters pass their improved genes on to the next generation.

377 posted on 03/15/2002 11:58:31 AM PST by Junior
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To: Aquinasfan
And how is this is different from differentiation by small mutation?

Is this the first time anyone ever explained punctuated equilibria to you? Of course it's "differentiation by small mutation." All scientific theories of evolution involve "differentiation by small mutation"; punk-eek is not all that different from classical darwinism in that respect.

386 posted on 03/15/2002 12:35:05 PM PST by Lurking Libertarian
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