10 Great Excuses For Not Reading Your Bible

All good questions, dear metmom. And if we can discuss this charitably as fellow Christians, I can try and answer a few of them:

1. But if someone is serving Mary, they are not serving God. If they are trusting Mary, they are not trusting God...Mary and God are not interchangeable. Trusting Mary does not be default translate into trusting God.

Catholics do not trust in Mary the way we trust in God. The Church clearly teaches Mary is a creature and nowhere near being divine. The trust we put in Mary is as someone close to God that prays for us. Just as, since you are a sincere Christian, I would trust in your prayers more than I would someone I knew was a hypocrite or an atheist.

2. I would like some Catholic somewhere to explain exactly what the point of all this Mary stuff is anyways.

It's hard to pinpoint what you mean by "Mary stuff" without further elaboration. If you mean the charge that Catholics worship Mary or depend on her for our salvation, or see her as divine, these are false charges that can easily be refuted by looking at what the Church actually teaches about these things. If it is the charge that some individual Catholics sometimes (out of ignorance) have an excessive devotion to Mary and blur the lines between her and God, that is regrettably true. In doing so, they are relying on pietistic and emotional custom, not on the teachings of the Church.

3. Will God not listen to those who follow Him when they pray?

Yes God will and does. But he also desires us to pray for each other. This is what Catholics believe Mary does for those who ask her for her prayers, as I noted above.

4. Was Jesus atonement not enough in and of itself that works must be added to it?

The Church nowhere teaches that Mary atones or has atoned for the sins of man. Only Christ's atoning death on the cross did that.

Works are a different topic. The Catholic Church forcefully teaches that we cannot save ourselves by our own works. However, since, as James in his epistle say, "Faith without works is dead", our works do play a part.

5. Is the Holy Spirit incapable of giving grace to the believer that Mary is necessary to fill in?

The Church teaches that grace comes from God alone. It does not teach anywhere that grace comes from Mary. The most one could correctly say is that we can ask Mary (or anyone else) to pray for us that we may be more open to God's grace.

6. If God can do it all, then what’s the point of all the Mary stuff? It’s redundant.

Because it isn't redundant because Mary doesn't have divine power to do the things that only God can do. Her role is to be someone that can pray for us, just as we do for each other.

7. If Mary is necessary, then people think that God is not enough in and of Himself to do His own work without “help” from Mary and that makes God less than God and Mary greater than Him as she is filling in what He lacks.

Mary is only necessary in the sense that all Christians, as members of the Body of Christ, are all necessary. She has her role to fill and we have ours. It doesn't take anything away from God for his faithful creatures to have a role in his kingdom and in bringing those called to be his children into relationship and eventually into heaven with him. Doing the work that God has called us to do doesn't make us greater than God, and neither does it make Mary greater.

FWIW, no Christians will be condemned. Many who call themselves Christians will be, but no genuine believers in JESUS, will be.

On that we can agree.

If you want to know what the Church really teaches about Mary, you need to get it from the Church itself, not what someone has told you it teaches or what you mistakenly believe it teaches or by the bad example of the Catholics you know or hear about who sadly do not follow the teachings of the Church. For this I won't refer you any polemical or apologetics material about the Church, but right to the source, the Catechism of the Catholic Church. If it isn't in there or referenced there, the Church doesn't teach it. For example:

CCC 970 "Mary's function as mother of men in no way obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows its power. But the Blessed Virgin's salutary influence on men . . . flows forth from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rests on his mediation, depends entirely on it, and draws all its power from it." "No creature could ever be counted along with the Incarnate Word and Redeemer; but just as the priesthood of Christ is shared in various ways both by his ministers and the faithful, and as the one goodness of God is radiated in different ways among his creatures, so also the unique mediation of the Redeemer does not exclude but rather gives rise to a manifold cooperation which is but a sharing in this one source."

CCC 971 "All generations will call me blessed": "The Church's devotion to the Blessed Virgin is intrinsic to Christian worship." The Church rightly honors "the Blessed Virgin with special devotion. From the most ancient times the Blessed Virgin has been honored with the title of 'Mother of God,' to whose protection the faithful fly in all their dangers and needs. . . . This very special devotion . . . differs essentially from the adoration which is given to the incarnate Word and equally to the Father and the Holy Spirit, and greatly fosters this adoration." The liturgical feasts dedicated to the Mother of God and Marian prayer, such as the rosary, an "epitome of the whole Gospel," express this devotion to the Virgin Mary.

"We get a hint of that Day in Revelation 20. We will individually stand before the Lord — for sentencing, not determination of guilt. There will be the “books” [the Bible] and the Book of Life. We will be judged by what is written in the “books..... That study of the “books” will be our source of knowledge, our source of guidance and ultimately, our source of assurance of salvation..... If the Lord declares the Catholic version to be correct, millions of “Christians” will be condemned."

Actually, while you are correct that the Catholic version is incorrect, the Great White Throne judgment is only for unbelievers, not for believers who instead have already gone to be with the Lord as beneficiaries of the gift of eternal life thru effectual faith, and have already stood before judgment seat of Christ and realized the giving of and suffering the loss of rewards based upon their manner of workmanship in building the Lord's church (which true believers are all doing in some way, though man can not claim any credit) as a testimony to their faith, but all such are believers, and will rule under the Lord Christ for 1,000 years, and then sit as judges in the sentencing of the loss at the Great White Throne judgment.

Like as believers go to be with the Lord at death but have not been judged as to rewards, so likewise the lost go to Hell at death, but await their actual sentencing as to their degree of punishment.

For as regards believers we have the first resurrection in "the day of Christ," the "coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him" (2 Thessalonians 2:1) "Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand." (2 Thessalonians 2:1-2)

"the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.' (Revelation 11:18)

For what is our hope, or joy, or crown of rejoicing? Are not even ye in the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ at his coming? (1 Thessalonians 2:19)

Yet one is saved despite loss, and not because of such:

Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour. For we are labourers together with God: ye are God’s husbandry, ye are God’s building. According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. (1 Corinthians 3:8-15; cf. 2 Corinthians 5:10)

For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. (1 Corinthians 4:4-5)

And the best i see it, believers will first also go with the Lord to fight in the Battle or Armageddon and afterwards reign with Him for a 1,000 years, and then act as judges in the final judgment:

And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. (Revelation 19:14)

And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him. (Jude 14-15)

And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. (Revelation 19:19-20)

And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. (Revelation 20:1-3)

And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. (Revelation 20:4-6)

Now obviously all these who go to be forever with the Lord, and fight for and with Him, and are judged as to reward, and rule for Him are all believers. All before the final judgment. And in which judgment the two classes are also manifest, with the sheep being testified to as those who had effectual faith, versus those whose deeds evidenced the contrary (see further below).

And in which believers shall be judges:

Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? (1 Corinthians 6:3) As Jude said, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed.."

Yet which final judgment occurs after the devil is loosed for one final test of man, as he leads a multitude in rebellion against the Lord and His elect in a renewed world.

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. (Revelation 20:7-10)

And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:11-15)

For the lost have been in Hades with the selfish man of Luke 16, but like as believers were in Heaven yet not specifically rewarded for their faith (cf. Heb. 10:35) until the Lord's return, so also the unbelievers have not yet been sentenced to their degree of punishment relative to their works and accountability. And there are differences:

And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted unto heaven, shalt be brought down to hell: for if the mighty works, which have been done in thee, had been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day. But I say unto you, That it shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom in the day of judgment, than for thee. (Matthew 11:23-24)

Note that Catholics are not going to get this in their Catechism, for Rome is clearly in error in denying the literal thousand year reign of Christ in which there can be forgiveness for the lost who survived the great tribulation, while believers are as angels. And as regards the myth of RC Purgatory and the attempt to justify it by referencing forgiveness in the age to come, (Matthew 12:32) , it is this 1,000 year reign which Catholicism, denies that is "the age to come" in which there is forgiveness, for not all in the earth during the 1,000 year reign of Christ are believers, as some flesh survived the great tribulation, thus while in the millennium the Lord "shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young (Isaiah 40:11) yet speaking of the same period we also read, And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. (Revelation 19:15)

And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles. And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain. And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the Lord will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles. (Zechariah 14:16-18)

All need to turn to the Lord Jesus as a damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save + be baptized + follow Him!)

Elsie, everything the Blessed Virgin Mary has ever said, including in any Church-approved apparition, boils down to: Do what He tells you.

Oh really??

The 15 promises

(Given to St. Dominic and Blessed Alan de la Roche)

1	Whoever shall faithfully serve me by the recitation of the Rosary, shall receive powerful graces.
2.	I promise my special protection and the greatest graces to all those who shall recite the Rosary.
3.	The Rosary shall be a powerful armor against hell, it will destroy vice, decrease sin, and defeat heresies
4.	It will cause virtue and good works to flourish; it will obtain for souls the abundant mercy of God; it will withdraw the hearts of people from the love of the world and its vanities, and will lift them to the desire of eternal things. Oh, that souls would sanctify themselves by this means.
5.	The soul which recommends itself to me by the recitation of the Rosary, shall not perish.
6.	Whoever shall recite the Rosary devoutly, applying Himself to the consideration of its Sacred Mysteries shall never be conquered by misfortune. God will not chastise Him in His justice, he shall not perish by an unprovided death; if he be just, he shall remain in the grace of God, and become worthy of eternal life.
7.	Whoever shall have a true devotion for the Rosary shall not die without the Sacraments of the Church.
8.	Those who are faithful to recite the Rosary shall have during their life and at their death the light of God and the plentitude of His graces; at the moment of death they shall participate in the merits of the Saints in Paradise.
9.	I shall deliver from purgatory those who have been devoted to the Rosary.
10.	The faithful children of the Rosary shall merit a high degree of glory in Heaven.
11.	You shall obtain all you ask of me by the recitation of the Rosary.
12.	All those who propagate the Holy Rosary shall be aided by me in their necessities.
13.	I have obtained from my Divine Son that all the advocates of the Rosary shall have for intercessors the entire celestial court during their life and at the hour of death
14.	All who recite the Rosary are my children, and brothers and sisters of my only Son, Jesus Christ.
15.	Devotion of my Rosary is a great sign of predestination.

"The Most Holy Virgin in these last times in which we live has given a new efficacy to the recitation of the Rosary to such an extent that there is no problem,

no matter how difficult it is, wheter temporal or above all spiritual, in the personal life of each one of us, of our families...that cannot be solved by the Rosary.

There is no problem, I tell you, no matter how difficult it is, that we cannot resolve by the prayer of the Holy Rosary."

Sister Lucia dos Santos

I hope you will eventually see the truth in this.

I think I have.

"She is the pure, 100% human, She is now the Queen Mother in heaven.

Scripture no more teaches that the Ark typified Mary but contradicts that assertion, then it does the other aspects assigned to the Mary of Catholicism.

Do you really think Jesus, her forever loving and devoted son, can refuse what she gently requests of him, when the only message she conveys is, Do what he tells you?"

Certainly if as on earth, the Lord could even refuse to leave His preaching to come to her, (Matthew 12:47,48) but unlike on earth we have no warrant to presume believers in Heaven ask the Lord to do anything. The only communication is that of martyred believers asking how long it will be before He executes judgment upon the wicked. (Revelation 6:10)

Yet even if believers ask anything this simply does not validate praying to them. Nowhere in Scripture do we see any believers engaging in prayer to created beings in Heaven (PTCBIH), or instructed to do so, despite the Spirit inspiring the recording of over 200 prayers by believers, and despite this being a most basic practice, and despite there always being plenty of created beings to pray to, and occasions for it since the Fall. Yet the only prayers or offerings in Scripture to anyone else in the spiritual world is by pagans, including to the only Queen of Heaven see therein.

Failing to find even one example of PTCBIH, and with instruction on who to address in prayer to Heaven only being that of to the Lord, thus you must resort to eisegetical extrapolation, presuming those in Heaven can not only hear/understand all prayers from earth, mental or oral (which only God is shown able to do), but that we are to address them, though again the Holy Spirit never mentions even one example of doing so.

Meanwhile, from what I recall, any two-way communication btwn created beings in Heaven and earth required both to somehow be present in the same location, and was not that of asking them to intercede to God for them, and was very rare.

Note that elders and angels offering prayers (Rv. 5:8; 8:4,5) in memorial - like as in Lv. 2:2,15,16; 24:7; Num. 5:15; 16:9, "an offering of memorial" cf. Num. 16:9, - is not that of them being addressed in prayer, nor does it indicate that they had heard them previously, nor is it described as being a regular postal service, but it is one of the things which is a preclude to the final judgments upon the earth, testifying to the persecutions of the saints by the devil and world that it fit to be punished.

For when "He maketh inquisition for blood, he remembereth them: he forgetteth not the cry of the humble. (Psalms 9:12; cf. Genesis 4:10) and before judgment God brings forth testimony of the warrant for it, which includes the cry of those martyred souls under the altar in Rv. 6:9, and with odors representing prayer, akin to Leviticus 6:15, "burn it upon the altar for a sweet savour, even the memorial of it, unto the Lord." (Leviticus 6:15)

Nor can Prayer to created beings in Heaven be extrapolated from general commands to pray or from requests for pray from other believers on earth, for this ignores the God-ordained divisions btwn realms. Which is why Christ had to come down to this earth, while only God is shown able to hear all prayer from Heaven, which is a Divine privilege and attribute nowhere shown to be given to humans.

The only heavenly intercessor btwn man and God is said to be Jesus Christ, (1 Timothy 2:5) and by Him believers have immediate spiritual access with humble contrite boldness into the holy of holies in Heaven to pray to the Lord God, (Hebrews 10:19) while the Spirit within believers cries out “Abba, Father,” (Galatians 4:6) and not “Mama, Mother.”

And believers kneeling before a statue and praising the entity it represented in the unseen world, beseeching such for Heavenly help, and making offerings to them, and giving glory and titles and ascribing attributes to such which are never given in Scripture to created beings (except to false gods) - including having the uniquely Divine power and glory to hear and respond to virtually infinite numbers of prayers individually addressed to them - would constitute worship in Scripture.

Moses, put down those rocks! I was only engaging in hyper dulia, not adoring her. Can't you tell the difference?

Thus to obey Jesus as Mary instructed means not thinking of men beyond what is written, which Catholics are egregiously guilty of with their Mary, exalting (officially or with implicit sanction) as,

• an almost almighty demigoddess to whom "Jesus owes His Precious Blood" to,

• whose [Mary] merits we are saved by,

• who "had to suffer, as He did, all the consequences of sin,"

• and was bodily assumed into Heaven, which is a fact (unsubstantiated in Scripture or even early Tradition) because the Roman church says it is, and "was elevated to a certain affinity with the Heavenly Father,"

• and whose power now "is all but unlimited,"

• for indeed she "seems to have the same power as God,"

• "surpassing in power all the angels and saints in Heaven,"

• so that "the Holy Spirit acts only by the Most Blessed Virgin, his Spouse."

• and that “sometimes salvation is quicker if we remember Mary's name then if we invoked the name of the Lord Jesus,"

• for indeed saints have "but one advocate," and that is Mary, who "alone art truly loving and solicitous for our salvation,"

• Moreover, "there is no grace which Mary cannot dispose of as her own, which is not given to her for this purpose,"

• and who has "authority over the angels and the blessed in heaven,"

• including "assigning to saints the thrones made vacant by the apostate angels,"

• whom the good angels "unceasingly call out to," greeting her "countless times each day with 'Hail, Mary,' while prostrating themselves before her, begging her as a favour to honour them with one of her requests,"

• and who (obviously) cannot "be honored to excess,"

• and who is (obviously) the glory of Catholic people, whose "honor and dignity surpass the whole of creation." Sources and more.

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