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To: MHGinTN

>> Upon completing the remembrance ceremony, Jesus referred to the contents of the cup as wine and said He would not drink again of the fruit of the vine until in The Kingdom. <<

This goes back to my main argument with Daniel1212: the tendency to offer an additional meaning and pretend like it negates the Catholic meaning in dispute. What you say is true, but in no way negates the plain language of what he said.

>> Read the scene in all three Gospels which record it. Jesus identified the ceremony as a remembrance fo Him until He comes. <<

Yes. But even here, he means “remembrance” in a very literal meaning which has almost been lost to modern English. To “remember” is to bring someone back to you; they become a “member” (part of), as opposed to simply returning to mind (”reminder”).

>> The salvation of the dead spirit is a spiritual reality, not a hocus pocus through the alimentary tract. Read John 6 again, noting how many times JESUS refers to believing as the measn to receive the SPIRITUAL nourishment. <<

Again, please read what I wrote to Daniel1212 about the fact that sacraments are physical-world signs given to us so the spiritual world becomes more perceptible/understandable/objective/concrete.

>> JESUS shows us the metaphor is just that by identifying the fruit of the vine after the ceremony is completed. <<

You keep saying the ceremony is complete. Where do you get that actually drinking of the cup and eating the bread is somehow some epilog to the real ceremony, rather than its climax? Do you not understand the ceremony he is performing is the ritual Moses taught the Jews so that they would be passed over by plague of the death of the first-born? By splashing blood on the doorway, they were marked so that they wouldn’t die. Herein, they splash blood on their souls so that their soul will not die. If someone performed the ritual slaughter of the lamb, but did not mark their door, would they be spared? Maybe, but only by some miracle beyond what is promised by the ritual (c.f., “the good theif.”) You certainly would never say, “Meh, the lamb was only symbolism. You don’t need to pour the blood on the doorway.”

And yet, what purpose did splashing the doorway actually achieve? Does God not know who is an Israelite without seeing blood on the door? The purpose was that so the world might understand the meaning of marking their souls with the blood of the lamb.

The Calvinist, pseudo-Augustinian* worldview separates the physical world from the Spiritual world as if they have nothing to do with one another; the Catholic worldview follows the Jewish and ancient Christian one in the belief that the physical world is a manifestation of the spiritual world. (*Called pseudo-Augustinian because Augustine in no way believed just about any of the nonsense Protestants have attributed to him.)


207 posted on 02/16/2021 9:21:16 AM PST by dangus
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To: dangus
So you believe you can 'mark your soul' with eating into your digestive tract something your priests have through an incantation transmogrified into the flesh and blood of Jesus?

Do you really believe your soul is in the same spacetime coordinate system as the body? And what of the spirit which is aligned with the soul, the behavior mechanism? Jesus told us that a man eating or drinking something does not defile the soul or spirit because it comes out in the rought. Can you see how that applies to not gaining spiritual realness by eating of drinking something? Try to avoid using magic thinking when contemplating that issue.

208 posted on 02/16/2021 10:05:44 AM PST by MHGinTN (A dispensation perspective is a powerful tool for discernment)
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To: dangus
Sprinkling the Propitiation blood upon the Mercy Seat is a far off from drinking blood, which the Israelites were forbidden by God to do.

Your Catholic ceremony of pretending to drink the blood of Jesus is satan's mockery of the command from GOD against drinking blood, a command issued for 'throughout all your generations' which would include the generation men sharing the Passover supper with The Messiah.

217 posted on 02/16/2021 3:56:17 PM PST by MHGinTN (A dispensation perspective is a powerful tool for discernment)
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