The Dormition of the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Mother of God [2007]

Sword-In-Hat Blogspot ^ | 15 August 2007 | Rick Stuckwisch

[frnewsjunkie]

I offer you a deal. You leave me alone and I’ll leave you alone.

I’m not generally nasty, so cut out the ‘dialogue’ and have a great afternoon.

[MHGinTN]

Only a fool demands someone prove a negative. You are some piece of Catholic work you are!

For the discussion let's accept that half of Jesus's chromosomes are from Mary.When did the soul of the new HUMAN life become a tive, connected to the body of the NEW HUMAN Jesus? When did the Spirit of the Christ enter the soul of the Jesus?

[ealgeone]

>>“Well, yes you were....by the false message of the apparition to wear a man-made piece of cloth to keep you out of the eternal fire.”<<

Completely false. You’re literally making things up. I never wore a scapular because of any apparition.

It sounds like you're arguing semantics here. Did the apparition appear personally to you? That sounds like where you're coming from.

In either case, it really doesn't matter. You believed the message conveyed by the apparition. Whether you heard it from someone, read about it, however you got it, you believed it.

You believed the message of the apparition in some level of your mind or else you would not have worn the idol.

[ealgeone]

56“Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.”

57So the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”

58Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.”

59Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him, but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple.

John 8:56-59 NASB

[ealgeone]

>>“Yes, half of my chromosomes are from my Mother.”<<

Show that that did not happen with Jesus.

Show it did.

[terycarl]

You, my friend, do not have the truth ... don’t kid yourself

Yes he does, and I'm not kidding!!!!

[boatbums]

So that’s a “no”?

[MHGinTN]

LOL from terycarl no less. Faint praise indeed.

[MHGinTN]

And you can’t even see the circular logic you’ve employed! Truly, the natural man is in a fog.

[MHGinTN]

Checkmate!

[frnewsjunkie]

You can’t fool everyone all the time.... catholics believe they have it... from what I’ve seen posted, where does your “truth” come from... not all from the bible.. which makes it suspect at best.

I don’t want to argue with a catholic.. they have ONE opinion... THEIRS! No time for it... when it’s just wasted time. I’m as sure as they are sure... so don’t bother.

[ealgeone]

It's really not that hard to get the RCs into checkmate is it?

[Iscool]

You can’t fool everyone all the time.... catholics believe they have it... from what I’ve seen posted, where does your “truth” come from... not all from the bible..

They made it up...Unlike our scriptures, they have no source...And they just repeat it from one generation to the next...And then they tell each other their Church is infallible...Again, with no source...

They are no more legitimate than the Mormons...At least they have some gold plates to prove their source...

And then they tell us Peter was their first pope...Again, with no source...Peter would have scoffed at them and spit at them if someone would have accused him of being A Catholic pope to his face...He wouldn't be caught dead wearing a robe...And he wasn't going around boinking little boys...

[ealgeone]

Hey, we've got one RC claiming Jesus wasn't Jesus until He came to earth.

And he claims to have a phd!

[Al Hitan]

IIRC I don’t believe the 4th Council referred to her as ever-Virgin. I’ll confirm that later.

I just saw your note. I'm pleased you are looking into the ecumenical councils to see what the early Church had to deal with.

The link I posted is a discussion of the 4th council. I believe the author is the one using "ever-virgin" to refer to the Virgin Mary, and is not quoting the council.

With that said, "ever-virgin" is referenced in the council documents. And before this council "ever-virgin" was commonly used. Even in the 2nd council's documents you can find it. Also, "Mother of God" was commonly used before the 4th council and is referenced in pervious council records.

[Al Hitan]

Lord and God are two different words in the Greek.

Of course. I've already said that.

But Kyrios is used as a substitute for God. In the Septuagint, the Old Testament version commonly used during the time of Christ, the Hebrew name for God, YHWH, is Kyrios - Lord. The Old Testament verses I posted are evidence of that. Look them up in the Greek and you'll see.

Origins of the Use of Kyrios:

"Lord” was widely recognised to be a valid substitute for the divine name prior to NT times.

[metmom]

But Kyrios is used as a substitute for God. In the Septuagint, the Old Testament version commonly used during the time of Christ, the Hebrew name for God, YHWH, is Kyrios - Lord.

But this is from the NT that the words are different.

I see yet another example of Catholics adjusting the meanings of words in Scripture to suit their doctrine, instead of using Scripture to establish their doctrine.

[ealgeone]

Also, "Mother of God" was commonly used before the 4th council and is referenced in pervious council records.

Uh....no.

[ealgeone]

Some info on your "source":

This is the blog of Martin Shields: some time lecturer in Old Testament, author, IT consultant, amateur photographer, and a few other things as well.

Martin’s tertiary education began with a degree in Physics and Pure Mathematics. He narrowly escaped spending a year down a mine in Broken Hill looking for solar neutrinos by studying Theology, completing a Masters Honours degree on Genesis 1–3 and then his PhD on Qohelet (Ecclesiastes).

[Al Hitan]

But this is from the NT that the words are different.

I gave you one link that talked about the use of Kyrios in the New Testament for God. Did you read it? Here is another:

In a word, No – the divine name, YHWH, does not appear in any NT text, nor does any NT writer allude to it. Of the many OT quotations in the NT that include the divine name in the original Hebrew texts (e.g. Mt.3:3; 22:37; Mk.12:29; Lk.4:18), none carry 'YHWH' forward into Greek. All use the generic kyrios, or 'Lord', most likely because NT writers almost always – in 307 of 340 cases (per Archer and Chirichigno) – quoted the Greek LXX rather than translate from Hebrew, if they even knew the language.

Even the shortened form of YHWH that appears in some Hebrew personal names (e.g. Jehoshaphat = "Yah has judged") disappeared in Greek. Thus the Hellenized Mattias for Mattithyah (Matthew), Elias for 'Eliyah (Elijah), Ēsaïas for Yĕsha`yah (Isaiah), and Iēsous for Yēšūă (Joshua). These examples demonstrate that English translators of the Greek often re-introduced the Hebrew 'yah' connection, though not, curiously, for Jesus himself.

The ‘yah’ connection is also lost, then found, with the apparent transliteration of the Hebrew ‘Hallelu Yah’ (literally, ‘Praise Yah’, e.g. Ps.105:45) into the Greek allēlouïä in Rev.19, and often re-transliterated into English as ‘hallelu-jah’! This single NT syllable likely originates in the Hebrew name of YHWH, though the NT writer likely didn't know it.

I see yet another example of Catholics adjusting the meanings of words in Scripture to suit their doctrine, instead of using Scripture to establish their doctrine.

And I see yet another example that polemics are again more important than discussion for non-Catholics. None of the source I liked are Catholic as far as I know.