Why stay Protestant?

Medium Corporation ^ | 01/22/18 | Matthew Schultz

[ravenwolf]

3: That or just grow up. I’ll settle for posts that don’t sound like a 6-year-old throwing a tantrum.

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If you do not have the understanding of a 6 year old then it would be a waste of time trying to explain to you the meaning of Revelation Ch 17 and 18.

There has been books wrote about it explaining that the Catholic Church is the whore that sits on many waters and the protestant Churches are her daughters.

Although i do not agree with everything written it does make a lot of sense.

Consider this. Rev 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

God is talking to his people, what would Gods people be involved in that God would have to tell them to come out of?

If they are really Gods people they would only be where they thought God wanted them to be, in a religious institution?.

Think about it darlin.

[Trailerpark Badass]

What are the Father’s rewards Christ speaks of? Peace, grace?

When I do good works, which is not nearly frequent enough, it is because I am trying to live a Christ-like life, which was commanded of us because it is pleasing to the God whom we should love with all our heart.

Frankly, I see it as something between the faith alone and the earning through our own efforts, as Protestants see the Catholic view. Isn’t “accepting” Christ as Savior an act of volition?If someone chooses, who could choose otherwise, hasn’t he “earnedl his salvation? (Ugh, i hate typing on this ipad)

[metmom]

I certainly believe that without Christ’s sacrifice, none of us is redeemed. But I also believe that accepting Him as my savior is not confined to one moment, or thought. That, to me at least, would seem to be a “work, enacting my own salvation.

God tells us otherwise in the Scripture He inspired.

The work of saving is His when we believe and accept.

John 1:10-13 He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him. But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

John 3:14-18 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

John 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

When we are saved, it becomes a done deal and God seals that deal with the Holy Spirit who is the guarantee of our salvation. And He placed us, seated us, in heaven with Jesus.

Ephesians 1:13-14 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.

Ephesians 2:4-7 But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.

Colossians 1:13-14 He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Colossians 2:13-14 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross.

[Trailerpark Badass]

I’ve been in many Protestant churches to worship Jesus Christ, so yes, Ikll just have to conclude that our experiences were very different.

[Trailerpark Badass]

So, “believing” and “accepting,” they’re not choices?

[Luircin]

First, I really don’t care what ‘books have been written’ in regards to religious matters unless they were written by the Apostles (or prophets or companions of either) or can prove that they’re in line with Apostolic teaching.

So neither you nor any other posters have convinced me that the RCC really is the whore of Babylon. Sure, there are plenty of arguments about it, but I’d rather point out where Catholic theology runs contrary to God’s Word.

Finally, quote-unquote ‘Protestant’ churches were always about trying to get back to the beliefs of the New Testament church, which was most certainly NOT Roman Catholic. So it’s disingenuous to claim that they’re the ‘daughters’ of Rome.

I still don’t get what argument you’re trying to make anyways, unless it’s just to try to insult Christians in general. You have a point you’re trying to get to, or are you just angry?

[Luircin]

Well, Paul says ‘faith alone.’ (It’s the best translation of Romans 3, especially when contrasted against the ‘works’ he speaks of.)

If you add any kinds of works to the faith that God’s grace is granted through, then it’s no longer grace, because the definition of grace is that it’s undeserved favor.

James 2 of course tends to come up in these conversations, but James is specifically writing to people who assume ‘faith’ means ‘intellectual assent’ and that’s how he defines the word when he uses it.

In other words, genuine saving faith always produces good works—barring saving faith that comes at the very end before any good works can be done, of course. If someone claims to have ‘faith’ but doesn’t act it out, the ‘faith’ is false.

After all, Jesus says that we must have faith like a child. A child has nothing of their own, can’t work to earn their keep. They can only receive what their parents freely give to them. So we have to be like a child towards the Lord, only believing in what he gives freely to us.

[metmom]

I think they are.

However, we don't have the power to choose unless God enables us. We can't even come to God in the first place unless He draws us.

John 6:44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.

But God doesn't compel.

Love is not love if it's not freely given.

And if God wanted a planet full of little automons, He could have it by just taking away our ability to choose and forcing people to be saved whether they liked it or not.

But that is not what is shown in Scripture to be the way He wants it to be.

However, once we make that decision, He seals us and essentially, protects us from ourselves.

If it depended on me to remain faithful, I don't know if I could do it.

I can't be good enough and I know that about myself. For that reason, I am happy to have His seal on me to keep me when I couldn't do it myself. And He more than has my permission to do so, as if He needed it.

So He brings us to the point of decision and let's us do the choosing. and when we've decided for Him, then He seals us. If we reject, we may or may not have other opportunities, but based on what I've seen, God is very persistent and gives most people many, many opportunities.

I heard many times before it finally sunk in and I *got it*. And I understood and made that decision.

But each time was a seed planted that just took time to bear its own fruit, that being my faith.

It's only when we die that the we are done with the chance forever and we are stuck with what we got.

[Trailerpark Badass]

So, what of a man, who, through his circumstances, in life, is not exposed to Christian teaching, never accepts and believes Him, does a lifetime of good works because it makes him feel good about himself (ie. appeases his conscience, not through any material, worldly gain)?

Is there any final accounting of his life, or not?

[Trailerpark Badass]

Cab’t find a single thing I disagree with there.

[boatbums]

It is the little things of the holy writings that prove them true, and distinguish liars that pervert them. It is not at all clear that you understand the meaning of the Remembrance Supper.

There are also such things as "disputable matters". It's not edifying to label others "liars" and perverters of God's word just because they might disagree with another's beliefs on such little things.

[Elsie]

Oooh!

You are right; but just who was it??

[Elsie]

... I cannot figure out if I have a tagalatwang or what. 😁

No!

I MUST resist!!

I will NOT make up a limerick about a Filipino transgender person!!!

[Elsie]

Read my response slowly and let you lips move...…………….

Now, Now, lets give credit where it is due:
Luk 12:51 Do you think I have come to bring peace to the earth? No, I have come to divide people against each other!
We have all heard the old joke, “there are two kinds of people in the world...………….”
What is the point Jesus is deviding on?
The answer to this is what we should be deciding on first. (note I said first) I have no doubt a few P will make it to heaven, and maybe even a few RC.
Division beyond the major point can lead to destruction or construction. But that does not mean we should avoid division, but maybe we should understand the math and check our work...

Well; I tried; but still nothing.

[Elsie]

Let me ask you: if there is some teaching, uttered by some obscure priest centuries ago, that is in error, that I don’t acknowledge, much less practice, I am still condemned, because I consider myself “Catholic?”

Let's find out!

Do you consider that Peter is the 'rock' that Christ's church is built upon?

[Elsie]

Good. Well, long as you remain believing the promise that it’s the grace of God, won by Jesus Christ, and not your own works that save you, then you’re good!

Even I can do better than THAT!

I wear a Brown Scapular!!

[Luircin]

Is there any final accounting of his life, or not?

***

God knows the heart, not me.

But YOU’VE been exposed to the Gospel, so believe it.

[Elsie]

I’ve never thought, nor remember being taught, that Protestants were not saved.

Perhaps the OTHER FR Catholics would like to comment on...

"One indeed is the universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved, in which the priest himself is the sacrifice, Jesus Christ, whose body and blood are truly contained in the sacrament of the altar under the species of bread and wine; the bread (changed) into His body by the divine power of transubstantiation, and the wine into the blood, so that to accomplish the mystery of unity we ourselves receive from His (nature) what He Himself received from ours."

--Pope Innocent III and Lateran Council IV (A.D. 1215)

Is this STILL valid today or not??

[Elsie]

...back to the beliefs of the New Testament church, which was most certainly NOT Roman Catholic.

Oh?

Well THESE beliefs and practices sure were!!!

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Found in Revelation chapters 2&3 

⁴ Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.  ⁵ Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.

 

¹⁴ But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.  ¹⁵ So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate.  ¹⁶ Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.

 

²⁰ Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.  ²¹ And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.  ²² Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.  ²³ And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

 

² Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God.

 

¹⁵ I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.  ¹⁶ So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.  ¹⁷ Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

 

 

[Mark17]

So do I....except my Gulf is a little closer to the US than yours!

My gulf is better than your gulf. 😁😊😆🤣