Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: metmom

The seven great letters of St. Ignatius of Antioch, written around the year 106 while on his way to Rome to be thrown to the beasts, take for granted the existence of local hierarchical churches, ruled by bishops who are assisted by priests and deacons. Ignatius, a living disciple of John the Apostle, writes that “Jesus Christ...is the will of the Father, just as the bishops, who have been appointed throughout the world, are the will of Jesus Christ. Let us be careful, then, if we would be submissive to God, not to oppose the bishop.”

Within each city there was a single church under a bishop, who in turn was assisted by priests in the spiritual realm and deacons in the administrative. The latter devoted themselves especially to alms-giving, and a striking feature of primitive Christianity is its organized benevolence.

These local churches were largely self-sufficient but would group around a mother church in the region — Antioch, Alexandria, Rome — and the bishops of each region would occasionally meet in councils. But they all considered themselves part of a universal Church — the Catholic Church, as Ignatius first called it — united in belief, ritual, and regulation.


364 posted on 11/18/2017 8:21:46 PM PST by Steelfish
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 363 | View Replies ]


To: Steelfish

OK, so nothing from Scripture. Just opinion pieces from alleged *church fathers*.

Nothing binding on believers.

Gotcha.


366 posted on 11/19/2017 1:30:11 AM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 364 | View Replies ]

To: Steelfish
If the writings of Ignatius were so fundamental to the faith why didn't Rome make them part of the canon at Trent...along with any of the other writings outside of Scripture Rome relies upon?

btw....still waiting on your theological credentials.

374 posted on 11/19/2017 4:32:07 AM PST by ealgeone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 364 | View Replies ]

To: Steelfish
Steelfish, your claims are unprovable. This does call your “credentials” of scholarship into greater doubt.

Writing in 1886, Dr. William P. Killen regarded all the Ignatian epistles, beginning with that to the Romans, as having been pseudepigraphically composed in the early 3rd century. His reasons included their episcopal emphasis, which is otherwise unknown before the reign of Callistus, the Bishop of Rome around 220.

Most scholars, however, accept at least the two Ignatian epistles which were referenced by Origen,[15] and believe that by the 5th century, this collection had been enlarged by spurious letters.

The original text of six of the seven authentic letters are found in the Codex Mediceo Laurentianus written in Greek in the 11th century (which also contains the pseudepigraphical letters of the Long Recension, except that to the Philippians),[16] while the letter to the Romans is found in the Codex Colbertinus.[6]

Some of the original letters were, at one point, believed to had been changed with interpolations.

The oldest is known as the "Long Recension" which dates from the latter part of the fourth century.[6] These were created to posthumously enlist Ignatius as an unwitting witness in theological disputes of that age, but that position was vigorously combated by several British and German critics, including the Catholics Denzinger and Hefele, who defended the genuineness of the entire seven epistles.[6]

At the same time, the purported eye-witness account of his martyrdom is also thought to be a forgery from around the same time.

A detailed but spurious account of Ignatius' arrest and his travails and martyrdom is the material of the Martyrium Ignatii which is presented as being an eyewitness account for the church of Antioch, and attributed to Ignatius' companions, Philo of Cilicia, deacon at Tarsus, and Rheus Agathopus, a Syrian.

quotes from Wiki

376 posted on 11/19/2017 8:07:50 AM PST by aMorePerfectUnion
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 364 | View Replies ]

To: Steelfish

Steelfish,

Why can’t you defend *any of your assertions* from God’s Word??

Let’s see some of the scholarship and theological credentials you always reference, reflected in your posts.

So far, every single assertion you made was easily refuted using Scripture and history.

Surely, your faith must be based on more than just assertions?

And most of all, I want you to know Christ and have eternal life and assurance of your salvation - based on *What God Said* and Christ.


377 posted on 11/19/2017 8:15:16 AM PST by aMorePerfectUnion
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 364 | View Replies ]

To: Steelfish

‘fish, for your further scholarship and thought...

http://www.bible.ca/history-ignatius-forgeries-250AD.htm


379 posted on 11/19/2017 8:28:57 AM PST by aMorePerfectUnion
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 364 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson