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To: Phinneous; metmom
Source, which refutes your self-hating non-religious Jew source’s intentionally-shocking rendering of the Talmud which neither he nor you understand in context, metaphor, or 2017 application to the modern day orthodox Jew whom you’ve never met

In fact, the article actually confirms everything I wrote, openly acknowledging the "failure" of the Talmud to permit the saving of Gentiles. Even the quote you provide admits this, albeit it tries to claim--without evidence--that in fact the Talmud only condemns saving non-Jews, from majority populations of non-Jews, who are persecuting Jews, even though the Talmud speaks only of subhuman heathens of every race and tribe. In fact, such a view contradicts the Talmud, since the Talmud actively warns against antagonizing the majority of the population. Therefore these instructions can only really apply when Jews are safe to behave in these ways. (Not to mention the view is abhorrent on its face, since it assumes that every Non-Jew from a majority population of persecutors, is also evil and thus should be permitted to kill indirectly or refuse to save--contrast with the Bible, from the OT down to the NT, which teaches a very different morality.)

Your article then goes into a discussion between Jewish religious scholars on how best to get around the Talmud's teachings on the matter. One of them is quite interesting. From your article:

"Be that as it may, Rabbi Moshe Sofer noted that the failure to save non-Jews would not only create enmity, but could also lead to gentiles refusing to treat Jews, or even to pogroms. As such, Jews must save the lives of all humans, even if it entails violating biblical prohibitions on Shabbat, because a lack of reciprocity endangers the Jewish community."

The justification here is not a moral one. Rabbi Sofer does not believe there is a moral reason to save Gentiles. He believes it should be done in order to protect Jews from persecution, because when people start thinking the Jews are an ethnocentric tribe that hates everybody, they come out of their houses and next thing you know, there's 20,000 dead Jews splayed out in the streets.

You will notice that the Talmud itself acknowledges this, as I just mentioned a moment before, and permits many such "exemptions" on the grounds of Jewish group interests, but not moral ones.

In any case, it appears you've failed spectacularly to demonstrate that me or Shahak misunderstand the Rabbanical teachings of the Talmud.

43 posted on 06/12/2017 12:56:35 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

You both misunderstand Judaism because you ascribe what you directly read in the Talmud to how Jews act and think today. Fall in my pool, I or any orthodox Jew would save you, even on the Sabbath.

A site which refutes all anti-semite website accusations against the Talmud and answers the classic Jew-baiting questions (why we let gentiles die, etc:) EVERY ONE of your deep-web searches is mistranslated or out of context. Otherwise what could you do, learn Hebrew and Aramaic and read the original for yourself?

http://talmud.faithweb.com/

And why do you do it (keep recycling anti-Talmud, anti-rabbi screed) despite what every orthodox FReeper has written to you? Because you’re an anti-semite? No, because you’re a nudnik. You got turned on to the anti-Talmud sites. It fits your beliefs nicely. (poor Jewish wretches— they need my sarcasm and bile! Halleluka!)

Hey, did you see what the Talmud says about people with faces made from loafs of bread? See— your funny points stick well.


46 posted on 06/12/2017 8:17:30 PM PDT by Phinneous (Moshiach Now!)
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