In A Moment: 10 Reasons I Believe In A Pre-Trib Rapture

Unsealed World News ^ | 6/9/17 | Gary

[amessenger4god]

1. The rapture is plainly taught in Scripture.  Believers will be physically removed from the earth according to 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17.  As soon as I hear someone say, "the rapture is not in the Bible," I know they've already lost the argument.  If you think 1 Thessalonians 4:17 is just allegory then there is nothing further to discuss.  If we can't agree on the basic meaning of words then we are not going to agree on anything.  The passage says Believers will be "caught up" from the earth and will meet the Lord in the sky.  Some even go so far as to argue that the word "rapture" is not in the Bible.  I'm utterly dumbfounded by that argument, which is the logical equivalent of saying there is no God because the word Yahweh is not in the Bible.  The word Yahweh is in the Bible - in the original Hebrew, just as the word rapture (specifically rapturo) is in the Latin Bible.  In the original Greek passage of 1 Thessalonians 4, the rapture is called the harpazo.  It's the exact same thing and silly word games and semantic-twisting will never change that fact.

2. Constant expectancy (a.k.a. imminency).  The early Church was well aware of the many events that had to transpire during the final years before Jesus returned to Israel.  The Apostles were intimately aware of these details because Jesus had shared the knowledge with them in His Olivet Discourse.  They knew that an antichrist (called the "man of lawlessness") would arise, the Temple would be rebuilt, and several years of great tribulation would ensue.  Yet the consistent sense of New Testament Scripture is that early Believers lived with a constant sense of expectancy for the Lord's imminent appearing.  Mid-trib, pre-wrath, and post-trib proponents handle these "imminency" Scriptures in a variety of creative ways, but I have never been presented with a satisfactory argument.  Only the pre-trib doctrine interprets the many Scriptures that describe an imminent appearing of Christ with their prima facie meaning.  More about this here.

3. Believers are going to Heaven.  Jesus told His disciples in John 14:2-3 that He was leaving them, but would come back and take them to be with Him in His Father's house (see also Hebrews 12:22-24).  This promise is as clear as day.  We know where Jesus went - He went to His Father's house in Heaven and sat down at His right hand.  The prophecy in Hosea 5:15 makes this even more clear.  While this promise doesn't necessarily rule out mid-trib or pre-wrath views, it does rule out many if not most post-trib theories.

4. The pre-trib rapture is built on promises.  Pre-tribbers are often mocked as being proponents of "easy-escapism", but the mockery doesn't change what the Bible plainly says in 1 Thessalonians 1:10, 1 Thessalonians 5:9, Luke 21:36, and Revelation 3:10.  Believers escape before the Time of Jacob's Trouble.

5. The Church is conspicuously absent from Revelation chapters 5 through 19.  The Book of Revelation is primarily about the events transpiring during the Tribulation and the Church is not mentioned one time between chapters 5 and 19.  Even more, Revelation 4:1 is a type or shadow of the rapture where the Apostle John is "caught up" to Heaven at the sound of a trumpet.  The 24 elders, which most biblical scholars consider to be a picture of the glorified Church in Heaven, are already present in Heaven in chapter 4 and from Heaven John and the elders are able to witness the Tribulation events occurring "below" on earth.  The only allusion to the Church in these chapters is found in Revelation 12, specifically Revelation 12:5, where a male child that represents the corporate Church is raptured to Heaven before Israel (the woman) enters into Tribulation.

6. Consistency in symbolism.  Noah and his family escape before the Flood comes.  As a matter of fact, God commanded Noah and his family to enter the ark seven days before the Flood came (Genesis 7:1-10) just as the Church will escape seven years before God's wrath is fully poured out.  Similarly, Lot and his family escaped from Sodom before the city was destroyed.  Furthermore, it wasn't just happenstance that Noah and Lot escaped before judgment - in Genesis 18:22-33 we learn that the reason they escaped beforehand was because God's very character was at stake.

Also, Joseph was a "type" of the Church and he was removed from his land and ended up in Egypt where he became royalty just as the Church will be raptured from this lowly earth and enthroned in Heaven (Revelation 3:21, 4:4).  Then the land of Israel underwent seven years of terrible famine while Joseph was tucked safely away in palaces of splendor.  A foreshadowing of the Time of Jacob's Trouble if there ever was one since Jacob himself, and his other sons, were suffering in the famine.

Another example was the Prophet Daniel who had been elevated to a high position in Babylon when Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were thrown into the fiery furnace.  Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were a shadow of Israel being protected during the Tribulation while Daniel was a shadow of the Church, which will be far away from harm.  Though later, Daniel himself becomes a shadow of Israel when he is protected in the midst of the den of lions.

Additionally, Jewish wedding customs at the time of Christ were a perfect parallel to the pre-tribulational rapture: the groom came and "purchased" his bride, making a binding, unbreakable agreement to return for her, he then went away to prepare a place for her in his father's house, and then around one year later returned for her with a "shout".  The groom and the bride went into the bridal chamber in the father's house where they remained hidden away for seven days while wedding guests celebrated outside.

7. The "departure" of the Church.  2 Thessalonians 2:3 contains the smoking gun: the Greek word apostasia here simply means "departure" rather than "falling away".  The first English Bibles all translated this word as "departure" as did some of the earliest Bibles such as the Latin Vulgate.  The context in the passage (gathering of the Church, removal of the restrainer, and revealing of the antichrist) in addition to the use of a definite article in verse 3, make this Scripture almost certainly a description of the rapture of the Church.  While translating apostasia as "departure" in 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is not necessary to believe in a pre-trib rapture and some pre-tribbers think the rapture is not mentioned in verse 3, if apostasia does refer to the rapture in this verse then on the basis of this passage alone, mid-trib, pre-wrath, and post-trib theories would be completely disproven.  J.D. Farag recently expressed some doubt about this, but I think he needs to study this out on his own.  I've read the various rebuttals to the 2 Thessalonians 2:3 rapture argument, such as those presented by Robert Gundry, and none of them seem particularly convincing.  You can read more about this here, here, and here.

2 Thessalonians 2 has another strong bit of evidence for the pre-trib rapture, which can be found in verses 6-7.  We learn quite clearly that the man of lawlessness (the antichrist) cannot be revealed until a certain restrainer is removed.  Most commentaries regard the restrainer to be the Holy Spirit working in and through the Church.  The removal of the restrainer necessitates a pre-tribulational rapture.

8. It upholds a proper dispensational understanding of Scripture.  Jesus was sent "only to the lost sheep of Israel", yet when His own people rejected Him, God turned His attention to the Gentiles - primarily through Paul, Barnabas, and company, but also through the Apostles themselves.  Daniel's 70 weeks of years, a period set by God to redeem Israel, paused at the end of the 69th week when Jesus was crucified.  This pause is commonly called the Church Age or the Age of Grace and it won't end until the 70th week begins (see Acts 15:12-16).  This 70th week serves two primary purposes: first, the national salvation of Israel (Romans 11:26), and second, a cataclysmic global judgment on the Gentile nations.  The Church is not in view anywhere in Daniel's 70th week.  Even more - the Tribulation is called the "Time of Jacob's Trouble" (Jeremiah 30:7).

9. The pre-trib rapture was not invented in the 19th century.  Nearly as silly as arguing that the rapture is not in the Bible, is arguing that the pre-trib rapture was invented in the 19th century.  Detractors have often attributed the pre-trib rapture's origins to a supposed vision from one Margaret MacDonald in 1830, yet MacDonald never described a pre-trib rapture.

Additionally, it is well known among Bible scholars that whether wrong or right, pre-trib beliefs go back at least to the 18th century, and likely to the early Church.  You can read more about this here, here, and here.

10. The woman in labor seals the deal.  The discovery of a literal astronomical alignment that fits with what is described in Revelation 12 has personally ended the debate for me.  Once we discovered that Revelation 12 should be taken for what it plainly says rather than allegorized and that it describes an actual, future event, the passage suddenly unlocked the meaning of a whole host of Scriptures in both the Old and New Testaments that refer to a "woman in labor" as the primary symbol of the beginning of the Tribulation (see Isaiah 13:6-13, Isaiah 26:17-21, Isaiah 66:7-11, Jeremiah 30:4-11, Jeremiah 49:23-27, Micah 5:3, Matthew 24:8, Mark 13:8, and 1 Thessalonians 5:3).  The woman represents Israel and the child in Revelation 12:5 appears to be a symbol of the Church and this particular child is said to be "raptured" to Heaven.  The timing of this child's birth and rapture?  Before the woman goes into labor (Isaiah 66:7-8).

This is by no means an exhaustive list, as there are many other reasons, but these are some of the particular points I find the most convincing.

VIDEO HERE

[grumpa]

The preterist view makes a lot more sense to me:

https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?resid=D3BD424B0B25B83F!11116&app=Word

[mdmathis6]

And to think you rely on a non cannon non biblical mystical”Book of Creation” to help you understand the Bible.../s

I do agree with you on this point, a lot of what is going to be revealed will be those things hidden in plain site...things that children often can see more clearly than we adults! (For of such is the kingdom of heaven).

[mdmathis6]

God told Abraham that Israel would be in Egypt 400 years but it was actually 480 years and some change due to Moses being 80 years old before leading Israel out of bondage....

My point being that while we know the general times of the coming of his kingdom, we need to be prepared to grant a little wiggle room for God to act beyond the tight time schedules we would like constrain him by! That was why Christ said “of that time no man knows save the Father in Heaven.” Take him at his word, literally...you’ll actually understand it better over time when one does so!

Christ will come, bye and bye...

[mdmathis6]

Amen...(let it be so, Lord jesus!)!

[SubMareener]

But wait! There is more! Science and Canon Scripture agree!

In the twentieth century AD, it became obvious that energy and energy states were quantized and could be emitted or absorbed only in discrete units. However, the theories and equations that were developed regarded space and time as continuous and thus infinitely divisible. As a result of not having a minimum space-time unit all of these theories postulate infinities within the physical universe that have not been observed.

The current “Standard Model” for Quantum Mechanics compensates for this through a process called “renormalization” in which one subtracts a big infinity from a smaller infinity to get a measured answer. The “Big Bang Theory” says the universe started as a singularity, then the laws of physics were suspended for a while as everything expanded at faster than the speed of light. “Here the magic happens” is clearly only a “scientific” theory because it is proposed by “scientists.”

But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. (Daniel 12:4)

Since we are near the time of the end, knowledge has increased! The Unified Field Theory proposed by Burkhard Heim (1925-2001) is a completely discrete theory that is based on the quantization of areas in multiple dimensions. It treats the universe as an accounting system, which is clearly in consonance with the Holy Scriptures, as we shall see. Originally proposed with six dimensions; it was later expanded into 12 dimensions to fully account for Quantum Mechanics. Heim calculated the mass values of the elemental particles using the 6-dimensional formulation and six experimentally measured fundamental constants, such as the speed of light in a vacuum, and arrived at values that were in good (!) agreement with observations.

Burkhard Heim arrived at a description of “the beginning” from the currently observed universe using logic and mathematics. He described the process he used in a presentation to the scientists at Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm (MBB) in Ottoburnn, Germany on November 25, 1976. An annotated transcript of the presentation and an English translation was produced by Olar Posdzech, Jim Graham, John Reed and Wilfried Kugel between 2000 and 2009. In this presentation, Heim derived the fundamental quantum of area which he called a “metron”.

In 1992, Tamar Auerbach explained the cosmology of Heim’s Theory as follows:

“In Heim’s theory both the metronic size, t, and the largest diameter D depend on the age of the universe. The dependence is such that D is expanding and t is contracting, so that D was smaller in the past and t was larger. It stands to reason that at one time in the distant past the surface area of a sphere of diameter D in our 3-dimensional world was equal to the size of t. This instant marks the origin of the universe and of time.
The mathematical relation between D and t is not simple, so that 3 different values of D are found to satisfy the criterion that the area of a sphere of diameter D be equal to t at the beginning of time. Evidently, the universe started as a trinity of spheres, whose diameters turn out to be (in meters):

D1 = 0.90992 m, D2 = 1.06426 m, D3 = 3.70121 m.

This trinity of spheres has important bearings on the structure of elementary particles.

From the first moment the universe began to expand, though at a slower rate than is presently predicted on the basis of the red shift of distant galaxies. Heim’s theory results in a present age of the universe approximately equal to 5.45 x 10^107 years, and a diameter D of about 6.37 x 10^109 light years. During most of its existence the universe consisted of an empty metronic lattice, whose metrons kept getting smaller as the universe grew larger.
Eventually, metrons became small enough for matter to come into existence. This may have occurred some 15-40 billion (10^9) years ago, at which time matter was created throughout the volume of the universe. Hence, according to Heim matter did not originate very soon after a “big bang” explosion but more uniformly in scattered “fire-cracker” like bursts, perhaps of galactic proportions. Spontaneous uniform creation of matter, coupled with the partly attractive and partly repulsive force of gravity mentioned in Section 3 resulted in the observed large-scale galactic structure of the universe. Creation of matter continues to this day, though on a very much reduced scale.”
Heim’s Theory of Elementary Particle Structures, T. Auerbach and Illobrand von Ludwiger published by the Journal of Scientific Exploration, Vol. 6, No. 3, pp. 217-231, 1992

Heim’s Theory then starts in an analogous way to the way the Hebrew Sages explain it:

And He created His universe with three books (Sepharim), with text (Sepher) with number (Sephar) and with communication (Sippur).
Kaplan, Aryeh (2004-03-15). Sefer Yetzirah: The Book of Creation in Theory and Practice (Kindle Locations 445-449). Red Wheel Weiser. Kindle Edition.

Now the Sefer Yetzirah is said to be part of the oral Torah, but we don’t know for sure, so it should be treated as commentary. So we must look for a pattern in the Torah that matches Heim’s Theory in order to consider Heim’s theory a match for the first creation story. The amazing thing is that the Torah’s description of the creation of the Nation of Israel fits the pattern of these three spheres (books) and the organization of the dimensions used in Extended Heim Theory.

If we simply number the 12 sons of Jacob in the order they were born, we get the following:

x1 Gen 29:32 So Leah conceived and bore a son, and she called his name Reuben; for she said, “The LORD has surely seen my affliction. Now therefore, my husband will love me.”
x2 Gen 29:33 Then she conceived again and bore a son, and said, “Because the LORD has heard that I am unloved, He has therefore given me this son also.” And she called his name Simeon.
x3 Gen 29:34 She conceived again and bore a son, and said, “Now this time my husband will become attached to me, because I have borne him three sons.” Therefore his name was called Levi.
x4 Gen 29:35 And she conceived again and bore a son, and said, “Now I will praise Yahweh.” Therefore she called his name Judah. Then she stopped bearing.
x5 Gen 30:6 Then Rachel said, “God has judged my case; and He has also heard my voice and given me a son.” Therefore she called his name Dan.
x6 Gen 30:8 Rachel said, “With great wrestlings I have wrestled with my sister, and indeed I have prevailed.” So she called him Naphtali.
x7 Gen 30:11 Then Leah said, “A troop comes!” So she called his name Gad.
x8 Gen 30:13 Then Leah said, “I am happy, for the daughters will call me blessed.” So she called his name Asher.
x9 Gen 30:18 Leah said, “God has given me my hire [wages] because I have given my maid to my husband.” So she called his name Issachar.
x10 Gen 30:20b Leah said, “...now my husband will dwell with me, because I have borne him six sons.” So she called his name Zebulun.
x11 Gen 30:24 So she [Rebecca] called his name Joseph, and said, “The LORD shall add to me another son.”
x12 Gen 35:18 As her soul was departing (for she died), she [Rebecca] called his name Ben-Oni [son of my sorrow]; but his father called him Ben-Jamin.

There probably is some significance to the names themselves, but at this point I have only looked at the birth order and grouping related to the dimensions used in Extended Heim Theory.

Leah’s first three sons, Reuben, Simion, and Levi, represent the R3 (x,y,z) Spatial Dimensions. Her fourth son, Judah, represents T! (t) Time. Note that this associates the genealogy of Jesus with time!

Rachel’s maid, Bihah, two sons, Dan and Naphtali, represent S2 (x5, x6) the Structure dimensions. These are the dimensions that provide the electromagnetic force. Heim’s initial theory used only these six dimensions.

Leah’s maid, Zilpha, responds with two sons, Gad and Asher, who represent I2 (x7,x8) the Information dimensions.

The next four dimensions are called the God Dimensions because these dimensions contains structures that steer the events of the other dimensions. They are associated with Jacob’s two wives. Leah’s last two sons, Issachar and Zebulun, and Rachel’s two sons, Joseph and Benjamin represent G4 (x9,x10,x11,x12).

Once I recognized this pattern, it was apparent that the Three Spheres (Books) were symbolized by Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

What are the chances of this happening if the Holy Scriptures are not the Word of YHWH, the True and Living God, Creator of the Universe?

[metmom]

Amen!

[ransomnote]

I beleive you are too eager to judge. The Lord says He alone knows the true hearts of men.
___________________
In Genesis 3:15, Satan gets Eve to doubt the Word of God. So, one could easily come to the conclusion that anyone who tries to get one to doubt the Word of God is an agent of Satan.
___________________
But you aren’t God. Reasonable Christians can and do disagree on the intention of text in the bible. There is one meaning and many attempts to apply it as intended. I am evangelical Christian and I believe that the correct interpretation of the tribulation doesn’t determine whether you are satanic or not, nor does the ability to agree with an anonymous poster on FR. You could have said all you did without the scorn and harshness and instead convey the truth and encourage others to see it, but you didn’t.

[editor-surveyor]

.
Wow, another brain dead pre-trib thread!

Its getting late to be talking this kind of trash, as we are just slightly more than 7 years away from the day of Trumpets as per prophecy.

We’re in the 6th seal period presently, and going fast to the day that Satan is cast out of the throne room.
.

[5cents]

Paul says we will be changed into His image and meet Him in clouds. Right?

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The messengers speaking to the Jews who saw Him ascending told them they would first see Him on Olivet

AV Ac 1:10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;

AV Ac 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Now which is it, in clouds or on the earth?

[editor-surveyor]

.
There are four feast dates remaining to fulfill:

Trumpets

Atonement

Tabernacles

Last Great Day

The “Last Great Day” is the 1335 day fulfillment.

They will be fulfilled as per the Biblical (agricultural) calendar, not the Roman nonsense calendar.

We are close to the return of the remaining land, which should happen this year with the 10th jubilee from the reformation.

We are in the 3rd Biblical month of the year 6017.

The fall of 6024 will bring the gathering of the Bride, and the beginning of the bowl judgements (10 days).

On the day of Tabernacles, 6024 we return with Yeshua to reign with him for 1000 years in his demonstration of the total depravity of man.
.

[editor-surveyor]

.
>> “Paul says we will be changed into His image and meet Him in clouds. Right?” <<

Changed into individually created Sons of Yehova.

In the cloud more likely should be “in the spirit.”

But the whole world will witness this event!

No one will be searching for the missing people.
.

[5cents]

The believing Jews at the time of the Lord’s return to earth will not be snatched away (which is what harpazo means). They will see an earthly resurrection as prophesied in Ezekiel, and in accord with the Lord’s very statements.
The body of Christ is spiritual and heavenly, rules jointly and equally in the heavens with neither Jew nor gentile in distinction, and apart from the covenant He made with His own earthly people.
The body must be removed for judgment to begin. The spirit of grace does not co-mingle with the wrath of God. Grace and judgment are separate spheres and do not abide together in anything He has performed.

[Jan_Sobieski]

Interesting...when have the entire world’s trees and oceans died? If Jesus is ruling and reigning from Jerusalem, why have I not been notified?!?

[5cents]

shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air:

G3507 nephele nef-el’-ay

from G3509;

properly, cloudiness, i.e. (concretely) a cloud:—cloud.

The original Greek is not “in the spirit.”, it is in clouds, literally.

It is best to believe God when He has said and recorded something, even though we may assume to know His mind better.

Besides, our present bodies would not fare too well in the scant atmosphere of the celestial realm, or heavens. We will need to be changed to fit that environment.

[Jan_Sobieski]

No man will know the day or hour. I will be you $10,000 dollars the Rapture does not occur on the day you say. Are you in?

[SubMareener]

That would be a stupid bet. I won’t be here to collect.

[editor-surveyor]

.
If you read all of the Bible rather than favored sound bites, you get the picture that we will be meeting “in the spirit.”

Its covered in many places.

The place we go to is not in the air, nor the clouds, but just around a corner that we cannot see with our Earthly eyes.

The realm of Yehova is all around us but we cannot see it unless he wants us to see it. Read John ch 3 carefully.
.

[boatbums]

read for later

[Lee N. Field]

No man will know the day or hour. I will be you $10,000 dollars the Rapture does not occur on the day you say. Are you in?

That would be a stupid bet. I won’t be here to collect.

Talk to your bank and/or your lawyer, they should be able to set something up.

[mdmathis6]

It still took 480 years when God told Abraham it would be 400 years(and years were 360 days each) for Israel to be enslaved in Egypt before being to be brought out of Egypt. Now some might argue that it was 400 years from that time until Moses would be born and then another 80 years to get him to the place where God would use him. Was God slack in his promise? I don’t believe so. There was a period of time that Israel lived in Egypt under Joseph’s protection where they weren’t treated badly and enslaved. It was probably after Joseph died and the memory of what Joseph had done for Egypt had faded that things got bad for Israel....the marker for the 400 years could start there, after Joseph’s death.

But now you get the idea why I’m skeptical of man made attempts to figure out to the tiniest morsel of time when God is going to come and wipe out all the bad guys. It’s been tried before by better mathematicians and Biblical scholars than you or I and somehow God doesn’t make the play date. Yet...when the world least suspected it...Israel was reborn as a nation and has withstood multiple attempts since then to destroy her from off the face of the Earth. She has blossomed like greenery in a desert(even satellite pictures show us that).

Jesus has revealed the envelope of time and events in which he will come but don’t count on being able to tick off each event like the ticking of a clock. The truth is, multiple events will go off or will be in the process of going off like strings of firecrackers firing all at once! Israel’s rebirth was like God saying to corrupt Earth (and Satan)...”you think I just went away, behold I’ve been in the middle of it all this time!(hidden in plain sight!)”