Posted on 12/27/2016 1:56:11 PM PST by Greetings_Puny_Humans
OCTOBER 30, 2013
Johann von Staupitz (c. 1460-1524) on God’s eternal predestination
Towards the end of the Middle Ages there was what one may describe as a Neo-Augustinian renaissance which included a number of outstanding theologians such as Gregory of Rimini. This increased interest in Augustine’s writings to a large extent set the table for the Protestant Reformation, specifically with regard to the doctrine of predestination. Johann von Staupitz (c. 1460-1524) was Vicar-General of the Augustinian Order in Germany and a very influential mentor of the young monk Martin Luther. Von Staupitz, however, later had to release Luther from the Augustinian Order (perhaps you’ve seen the 2003 film Luther – I remember the scene where Luther is released by Von Staupitz distinctly – see picture below) to preserve the good name of the Order with Rome.
[Image Omitted]
Though Von Staupitz never joined the Reformation and remained a Catholic both in disposition as well as in doctrine in a number of areas, he nonetheless still adhered to a number of Protestant-leaning doctrines, one of which was his view of predestination. He came to be associated with the “Lutheran heretics” as a result of it, and in 1559 Pope Paul IV put Von Staupitz’s works on the Index of Prohibited Books.
Below are a few excerpts from his work Eternal Predestination and its Execution in Time:
“In order that the whole plan of creation should not be frustrated, there has been ordained preservation by divine power for nature and for free will the grace of the divine Incarnation; and thus natural life is upheld by preservation, a morally good life is sustained by grace, and both by God Himself. Accordingly, before the creation of the world it was determined that no one would be able to do morally good works without the grace of Christ.
Because mercy and justice contribute equally to the praise of the Almighty it has been decreed that some should be elected and predestined to conformation with the image of the Son of God and to faith in our Lord Jesus Christ. But those who do not have faith are judged already.
This [election] is the first grace which precedes nature and works. No one elicits or merits this grace, nor is this grace due to merits foreknown by God, nor to good use of reason in the future foreseen by God, nor to merits already performed. Rather, the sole source of this grace is the most kind and generous will of God.
Once this first grace is given, other graces follow one by one without fail, and Christ is put under obligation to save the elect. That is exactly what He said to Zacchaeus, ‘It is necessary that I stay in thy house,’ implying that even this Israelite, this son of Abraham, was elected according to promise. Necessity in the same sense of the word led to Christ’s passion, crucifixion, and death for sinners…
Paul, illustrious doctor of the Church, tongue of Christ, and the most direct disciple of the most Holy Trinity said: ‘Those whom He predestined He Himself also called.’ He did not say, ‘He had them called,’ Many are called by the ‘light that has arisen over us,’ others by the law, by prophets, by gifts, by tribulations, by Apostles or preachers of the faith. But not all are elected. However, those who are freely predestined are called without fail in their lifetime unto faith by God’s powerful will. For indeed this is not done by Moses nor by the prophets nor by the Apostles, but by God Himself Who speaks to the heart.
Concerning this call the Son said, ‘No one comes to Me unless the Heavenly Father draws him,’ Paul also preached this in an excellent manner: ‘I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth.’ For indeed he who plants is nothing, nor he who waters, but He who gives the growth, that is God, is all.
Provided the exterior call is efficacious, then you could certainly say that all who are called [i.e efficaciously] will doubtless be justified. For just as God is committed to call all who are predestined, so He is committed to justify all who are called. This is not a natural obligation but an obligation of grace which the Apostle fully appreciates when he says, ‘He who did not spare His own Son but gave Him up for us all, will He not also give us all things with Him?’
For just as the knowledge of natural things flows from the knowledge of the first principle, so also each individual grace flows from the grace of predestination. In this and through this, as I have indicated above, Christ has been made the servant of our salvation and ‘has come into the world not to be ministered to but to minister and to give His life as a ransom for many’.”
– Johann von Staupitz (c. 1460-1524), Eternal Predestination and its Execution in Time, chapters IV & V
The process of laying our pride down to make room for salvation will also look like cowardice to the world... just to make an additional observation. Some of the biggest saints will be those who were the biggest bullies or chickens.
“When we are weak, then we are strong.”
At least post the entire verse:
The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance. (2 Peter 3:9)
The verse is directly addressed to the church (with you); it in no way implies a universal salvation. If God desired everyone to be saved, then everyone would be saved.
Did God harden Pharaoh’s heart? Was Judas predestined to betray Christ? Was Paul not knocked off a horse and struck blind?
Can a dead man make a decision? If the Spirit doesn’t first raise the dead, how are they to hear? does God wait around and hope you’ll respond, or does he see his Word working to fulfill His will? If you are saved by any act of human will, then why did Christ die?
“Everyone whom the Father gives me will come to me, and the one who comes to me I will never send away” (John 6:37).
“No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day” (John 6:44).
So Jesus added, “Because of this I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has allowed him to come” (John 6:65).
Our understanding is limited, but Scripture is clear. Everyone whom God calls will come to Him.
For by grace are ye saved through faith ; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.(Ephesians 2:8-9)
All who are saved are saved despite themselves, not because of some inherent goodness, reason, or human will. To say that election is somehow a source of pride defies reason and truth.
Save for later
Correct!
Good post, but to answer this question: God is proactive, not merely reactive, with man's salvation.
"'But there are some of you who do not believe.' (For Jesus knew from the beginning who those were who did not believe, and who it was who would betray him.) And he said, 'This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.'" (Joh 6:64-65)
Whether you believe, or reject the teachings of God, is entirely dependent on the granting of the Father. The "Christian is not the result of persuasion, but of power" (Ignatius, Epistle to the Romans). If you do not believe, it is because it was not given to you to believe.
God does indeed use circumstances, human instrumentality, and providence to draw His elect. However, no matter how many seeming "hoops" you had to jump through (all our struggles, though we do not understand always why God puts us through them, are for our benefit, for "all things work together for good to them who love God, who are the called according to His purpose"), it must be acknowledged that salvation is all of God. All things occur at His command, and nothing is owed to our alleged merits or greater knowledge in this process of salvation:
1Co_3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
But you're not "permitting" God to merely put a thousand dollars into your bank account. Confessing Christ is not an act that exists in a moral vacuum, as empty as a mere procedural vote in Congress, or the flipping of a light switch. Therefore, my questions are still unanswered, and you are still at step 1.
For example, the Lord is not willing that any should perish, but all come to repentance.
Peter here directs his passage "to us-ward," after discussing the reprobate for whom the fires of damnation are "stored." In other words, the proper reading is that God is not willing that any of His elect should perish, and this is the reason why the world has not yet been destroyed, because he is still gathering His people. You will find that a great many of the verses you believe refer to "all" people, as in every individual, apply to only specific groups, consistent with the context and even Jewish use of phrases like "all the men of the world," which they apply in their Talmud even to the citizens of a single city.
I believe there are some that will NEVER accept Jesus because it's just not in their DNA. They swing more to evil and Satan than people that have bypassed the genetic line of the fallen angels. Just a theory, but it might explain a lot.
BTW, do a word search on “earth dwellers” and see what you get. We are “aliens” here. Sons of men cannot go to heaven, but we have been given the “right” to become “Sons of God” Sons of God are created by God. That would be angels, good and bad, Adam and Eve, Jesus, and Christians. God is Spirit and we must be born of the Spirit to be Sons of God.
I think you are stuck on stupid.
The bible says don’t veer to the left or the right. We have a balance issue here.
Romans’ argument is telling us that God has all the rights.
Other scriptures tell us that God has all the generosity.
The result is a balance. God is due (A) the deepest gratitude; but also (B) the deepest confidence.
I hope this makes it clear. You seem to be lost in a labyrinth of mere words.
I think you think you are making profound, scriptural points, but in fact they are vapid and empty. You must have eyes to see and a heart to hear these things, but you do not have them yet. But when you get them, you will be quite blessed, and will regret your balancing act in the dark.
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