Posted on 02/10/2016 7:39:44 AM PST by Salvation
You can believe this is you want. That's fine. Paul praised the early churches for the good order. Their good order was adiaphora, neither commanded nor required. These acts do not replace grace. These rituals provide good order.
If someone says that these rituals or works replace grace, I will join you in their condemnation. But these rituals and structures are not forbidden or inherently bad.
It is neither commanded to the Church, not instructed, nor modeled, nor written about before 100 AD.
I don't think you properly understand adiaphora. The church is allowed to do thing not commanded nor instructed.
Formula of Concord: X. Church Rites, Commonly Called Adiaphora.
Therefore we believe, teach, and confess that the congregation of God of every place and every time has, according to its circumstances, the good right, power, and authority [in matters truly adiaphora] to change, to diminish, and to increase them, without thoughtlessness and offense, in an orderly and becoming way, as at any time it may be regarded most profitable, most beneficial, and best for [preserving] good order, [maintaining] Christian discipline [and for eujtaxiva worthy of the profession of the Gospel], and the edification of the Church. Moreover, how we can yield and give way with a good conscience to the weak in faith in such external adiaphora, Paul teaches Rom. 14, and proves it by his example, Acts 16:3; 21:26; 1 Cor. 9:19.
I Corinthians 14:40 - "But let all things be done properly and in an orderly manner."
The Apostle Paul, commanding the church to good order...
A poor banner to justify things. It explains the acceptance of the totality of syncretic paganism that was incorporated and celebrated. All of which is false.
Apparently. But another poster answered my question.
Everyone can post on this one.
Is that alright with you?
The one you posted is a caucus.
Ash Wednesday doesn’t belong to Catholicism, OTC Christians also participate.
Of course you can invite anyone your want into your caucus thread.
Exactly! Good order is commanded, but not defined. The church gets to decide what is good order.
I think you confuse belief with ritual. By the way, do you have January on your calendar? How dare you celebrate Janus the two-headed god!
You conflate the two....one is not ok the other. Context is your key to understanding the Word.
A good and blessed Holy Lent To All!
Ashes are a reminder that we are to die to ourselves, to LOVE God and LOVE others.
Actually, Paul specifies to the Corinthians what is and what is not orderly.
“How dare you celebrate Janus the two-headed god!”
There is a significant difference between using a calendar and elevating a pagan ritual to the status of being used, approved and encouraged in a Christian Church.
There is no difference. During January I don't worship Janus and during Ash Wednesday I don't worship Odin.
The claim that this or that Christian ritual is based on pagan roots is often used to try to discredit Christianity. It's often based on faulty logic and often contradictory. If you have a theological problem with Ash Wednesday, that's one thing. Guilt by association is another.
We might as well get rid of Christmas (and a host of other holy days) because of pagan roots.
Now the adoration of Mary does have pagan roots and that is a problem, but that's because it is theological rather than ritual.
Any pagan ritual/belief/practice that is combined with Christianity doesn't make Christianity better, it pollutes it. It doesn't redeem paganism. It turns the hearts of people from the miracle of salvation and creates a system of works.
Do you really believe that all good order is written about in 1 Corinthians 14? What about Colossians 2:5 "rejoicing to see your good order"? This good order of the Colossians is never enumerated.
The fact is that 1 Corinthians 14:40 all things should be done decently and in order. Some of this good order is covered in the Bible. Other details are left up to the church.
I doubt your assertion that Ash Wednesday has pagan roots. I am part of a liturgical church that celebrates the church year along with feasts and festivals. This good order has been built over years. It has nothing to do with works. We are saved by grace, through faith, for works. The good order is a construct in which we operate.
If there is something wrong with the practices of Ash Wednesday, let's hear it. If there is truly a problem, then we need to reform or eliminate the practice. But I have no interest in dismantling tradition because some expert studied history and equates a pagan practice with church tradition. Just search "pagan roots Christianity" and you can drive yourself crazy.
Please post the roots and dates of any Christian source. We know it didn't appear during the time of the Apostles. It was added later.
We know the practice of wearing ashes honored a false god to earn his favor, as posted above. If this is not so, it should be demonstrable.
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