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To: MHGinTN
Thank you , but is there some scripture to which you might direct me, to support this notion?

That's a massive study. Instead of copying and pasting another person's words I'll start simple:

1Th 4:13 ¶ But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep,...

Those that are asleep are those that have died before us.

...that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

God is bringing the dead with him here. We're not meeting Him there.

1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

We cannot precede the dead, they are already with Him.

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God:...

The Trump of God is the seventh. Satan comes at the sixth.

...and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Those that have died before our time have already risen and are waiting to meet us on earth.

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds,...

Clouds of people.

...to meet the Lord in the air:...

"Air" is the "spirit" in the Strong's.

...and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Again, this is at the Seventh Trump, when Satan is defeated and locked up for a thousand years. Those found worthy will be with the Lord forever, those not will be burned up after the Millennium.

252 posted on 07/26/2015 10:57:48 PM PDT by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: Partisan Gunslinger; Iscool; Mark17; Mom MD; metmom; caww; Springfield Reformer; dartuser; ...
There is a little book which might be of interest to you, who knows? Title is 'Unlocking The Secrets of The Feasts' by Michael Norten. Here's a quote from the book, near the end (book is less than 100 pages of text):

God apparently patterned the order of the resurrection after the patterns of the harvests. The Rapture of he church can be illustrated by the barley harvest because of the winnowing by the wind[Remember what Jesus said to Nicodemus in John 3, about the wind?], the softness of the shell, and its being in the first harvest season. Those believers who come out of the tribulation are illustrated by the wheat harvest because of the stiff upright neck and the crushing by the tribulum. The taking away of unbelievers for impending judgment at the end of the Tribulation in the battle of Armageddon is illustrated by the fruit of the harvest and the winepress. And the ushering of the believers out of the Tribulation is illustrated by the gleanings because they are not harvested or resurrected but they live on in the Millenium in their non-resurrected bodies. (p84 Unlocking The Secrets Of The Feasts, Michael Norten)

Understanding the Feast Times of Israel is a useful tool in getting at the Truth in Scriptures. Jesus fulfilled ALL of the Spring Feast forshadowing of Him on the actual day prescribed in chapter 23 of Leviticus. He will doubtless fulfill the Fall Feasts in the same fashion. So understanding the Feasts and what they foreshadow is a useful part of a believer's data set.

307 posted on 07/27/2015 8:16:20 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Is it really all relative, Mister Einstein?)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger; MHGinTN
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds,...

Clouds of people.

No. The context is the literal use of cloud, which is the context of Mt. 24:30 and Mk. 13:26, and as understood by the Sanhedrin in His trial (Mt. 26:64, Mk. 14:62) and not in the figurative sense of Heb. 12:1. This is not a metaphor, and cannot be taken so in this context.

...to meet the Lord in the air:...

"Air" is the "spirit" in the Strong's.

Sorry, in this it is not "spirit" in Strong's Dictionary of his Concordance, nor is it "spirit" anywhere in the Authorized Version. It is never used in the figurative sense. In this, your claim is absolutely wrong:

=========

From Strong's Concordance:

Strong's No. G109
ἀήρ
aēr
ah-ayr'
From ἄημι aēmi (to breathe unconsciously, that is, respire; by analogy to blow); “air” (as naturally circumambient): - air. Compare G5594.

=========

Furthermore, "spirit" even if correct (and it is not) would be a figurative translation of a word which in context must be translated literally. That is very poor interpretation, as you have done in the next:

...and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Again, this is at the Seventh Trump, when Satan is defeated and locked up for a thousand years.

This is entirely presuming that the Seventh Trump of Rev. 11:15 has any connection with the trumpet of this context. Even the contexts are not the same.

I just don't believe your hypothesis here can be given any serious recognition, because it is eisegesis, not exegesis, and even then forced.

The correct frame of mind is given in the next chapter, verses 9 and 10:

"For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him."

Not His tribulational wrath, because of the imputation of Christ's righteousness, and certainly not of Satan's. Furthermore, I believe the salvation mentioned here is not only the cetification of it by entrance into His Kingdom through justification by faith, but the realization of it by the saving through joining Him in the clouds in the new spiritual body. Anything else than that is not much of a salvation, is it?

709 posted on 07/31/2015 6:50:34 PM PDT by imardmd1 (Fiat Lux)
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