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To: aMorePerfectUnion
None of those verses says the church - any church - is infallible. Every Christian has the I dwelling Spirit to guide them into truth.

This is only your interpretation of those verses, an interpretation that you yourself should not claim is infallible. Nowhere does the Bible say that it is the individual as opposed to the church that is guided by the Holy Spirit to the truth. This is your a priori assumption.

As for the authority of the Church:

• Matthew 16:19 was addressed to a single individual, Peter.

• Luke 10:16 was addressed to the appointed 72, not to the all the disciples.

• John 14 was again addressed to only the twelve Apostles, not to all the disciples.

• Matthew 23:1-3 refers to the authority of those who hold a teaching office among the faithful.

• Acts 15:28 was a decree of the apostles and presbyters gathered in Jerusalem addressed to the church in Antioch. These were those who held a visible office in the church and who specifically invoked the authority of the Holy Spirit in giving their instruction.

No, these passages do indeed show a visible and hierarchical church teaching with the authority of the Holy Spirit itself. But what if we were to take your position that "every Christian has the I dwelling Spirit to guide them into truth?" Would this not also apply to the half of the world's Christians who are Catholic. If they come to conclusions about the meaning of Scripture that differs from yours, who are you to claim that you are guided by the Holy Spirit and have the truth and they are not?

Again, we have the sovereignty of God as the foundation of confidence in the accuracy and preservation of his word.

Yes, but by what means does he exercise this authority? By each individual contradicting one other or by the church that He established and with which He provided a visible leadership?

26 posted on 04/29/2015 6:30:49 AM PDT by Petrosius
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To: Petrosius; aMorePerfectUnion
>>Nowhere does the Bible say that it is the individual as opposed to the church that is guided by the Holy Spirit to the truth.<<

Acts 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; 9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

1 John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

We are to even check those who would purport to teach.

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

The admonition has always been that it's the individual. The Catholic Church lies when it usurps the responsibility of the individual

27 posted on 04/29/2015 6:39:26 AM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus)
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To: Petrosius

Peter -passed into glory and no longer on earth
72 - gone
12 - gone

None were infallible.

Yor other point about the in dwelling Spirit allying to every believer has already been addressed.

You seem quite worried about whether Christians agree on 100% of Scripture. They never will. The Apostle Paul addressed this in the Epistles.

As to your point about the catholic denomination ... Assuming a portion are saved, they have the Holy Spirit within to guide them as they seek guidance. true of all denominations. This never means you have a license to distort God’s Word.

In addition to His Spirit, He has also gifted His assemblies with Pastors and teachers to guide and discipline when necessary. Paul addresses this in the Epistles as does Peter.


28 posted on 04/29/2015 7:10:40 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "Forward lies the crown, and onward is the goal.")
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