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To: daniel1212; FourtySeven; Springfield Reformer; BlueDragon; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; ...
The one passage in Scripture that blows the whole idea that there's a need for complete unity of doctrine established by an committee and lockstep adherence to it or you're out of communion with the church or self-ex-communicated, or whatever, is Romans 14.

There are areas where dispute is allowed for, things that Paul refers to as *disputable matters*.

GOD HIMSELF, through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, allows room for disagreement on issues. Who are people to try to usurp that?

Romans 14:1-23 As for the one who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not to quarrel over opinions. One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables. Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him. Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us lives to himself, and none of us dies to himself. For if we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord. So then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord's. For to this end Christ died and lived again, that he might be Lord both of the dead and of the living.

Why do you pass judgment on your brother? Or you, why do you despise your brother? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God; for it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.”

So then each of us will give an account of himself to God.

Therefore let us not pass judgment on one another any longer, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother. I know and am persuaded in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself, but it is unclean for anyone who thinks it unclean. For if your brother is grieved by what you eat, you are no longer walking in love. By what you eat, do not destroy the one for whom Christ died. So do not let what you regard as good be spoken of as evil. For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking but of righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. Whoever thus serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men. So then let us pursue what makes for peace and for mutual upbuilding.

Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make another stumble by what he eats. It is good not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything that causes your brother to stumble. The faith that you have, keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who has no reason to pass judgment on himself for what he approves. But whoever has doubts is condemned if he eats, because the eating is not from faith. For whatever does not proceed from faith is sin.

We are all works in progress, all beginning at a different place in life with a different background of teaching, experiences, upbringing, etc. God works on us from the inside out, taking care of first what HE knows needs to be dealt with the most. It isn't going to fit someone else's ideas of what should be going on but rather God's timetable and plan.

People in their arrogance, presume to sit in judgment on others, pointing fingers at each other in pride, condemning them for not being like us, when we don't even know if we'd be doing half as well as them if we started from where they are, and presuming to sit in judgment of the work of God in their lives, in effect sitting in judgment on God.

And what's really the worse sin?

The smoking? The drinking? The perceived error in doctrine?

Or the pride, judgment, and condemnation that is in us when we sit in judgment of others who we really are no better than or who are no better than us?

The problem with a legalistic religious system, be it Catholicism, some Baptist churches, some cult churches, whatever, is that it fosters an us against them mentality where we condemn others for things that God does not and then it puffs people up with pride. It leaves no room for mercy and compassion. Just beating someone over the head for failure to measure up to the standards established by some church hierarchy.

Dealing with sin means dealing with the heart, not just the outward actions. After all, the Pharisees were righteous, ACCORDING TO THE LAW.

In Catholicism, I found NO room for mercy and grace, just judgment and condemnation, always being beat over the head with it, needing to beg God for forgiveness, thinking He would reject me for any least little sin, looking for an excuse to send me to hell for the least little infraction, and punishing for for the same.

Fortunately, I found out what God is REALLY like....

Psalm 103:1-14Bless the Lord, O my soul, and all that is within me, bless his holy name!

Bless the Lord, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits, who forgives all your iniquity,who heals all your diseases, who redeems your life from the pit, who crowns you with steadfast love and mercy, who satisfies you with good so that your youth is renewed like the eagle's.

The Lord works righteousness and justice for all who are oppressed. He made known his ways to Moses, his acts to the people of Israel.

The Lord is merciful and gracious, slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love. He will not always chide, nor will he keep his anger forever. He does not deal with us according to our sins, nor repay us according to our iniquities.

For as high as the heavens are above the earth, so great is his steadfast love toward those who fear him; as far as the east is from the west, so far does he remove our transgressions from us.

As a father shows compassion to his children, so the Lord shows compassion to those who fear him. For he knows our frame; he remembers that we are dust.

The Catholic church needs to get over itself and stop trying to make cookie cutter Christians out of people.

1,094 posted on 05/05/2015 12:43:31 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: metmom

Well done!


1,100 posted on 05/05/2015 6:07:14 AM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus)
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To: metmom

What a beautiful message you bring. Strong meat, with taste for a banquet.


1,107 posted on 05/05/2015 8:17:51 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Is it really all relative, Mister Einstein?)
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To: metmom
Catholicism, I found NO room for mercy and grace, just judgment and condemnation, always being beat over the head with it, needing to beg God for forgiveness, thinking He would reject me for any least little sin, looking for an excuse to send me to hell for the least little infraction, and punishing for for the same.

I have no concept of where you learned such a warped idea of what Catholicism is, but untold billions of people have interpreted it slightly differently that you did....Do you really suppose that people, over the centuries (20 of them) would have clung to, loved and accepted a vision of God and salvation as you have described?????

Catholicism IS Christianity, the johnny come lately versions just aren't all there...some are in serious error, most are just readers digest versions of what true Christianity is.

1,210 posted on 05/06/2015 8:19:23 PM PDT by terycarl (COMMON SENSE PREVAILS OVER ALL...)
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