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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Careful, 2D:

from http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?id=788

]Luther’s]views of Mary as Mother of God and as ever-Virgin were identical to those in Catholicism, and his opinions on the Immaculate Conception, Mary’s “Spiritual Motherhood” and the use of the “Hail Mary” were substantially the same. He didn’t deny the Assumption (he certainly didn’t hesitate to rail against doctrines he opposed!), and venerated Mary in a very touching fashion which, as far as it goes, is not at all contrary to Catholic piety.


50 posted on 03/28/2015 1:06:00 PM PDT by stanne
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To: stanne

Mary is no closer to God than any other person, past or present.

When referring to Deity, the Bible mentions only the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit (Matthew 28:19; cf. Matthew 3:16-17; John 10:30; 17:21; Acts 5:3-4). Mary is never mentioned in that context. Further, the heaven where God and His angels reside (Deuteronomy 10:14; 26:15; 1 Kings 8:27,30) is not yet inhabited by human beings. Jesus said: “No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man” (John 3:13, emp. added). These words represent the truth about all the people who have left this world (including Mary). No one is in heaven because heaven is reserved for all faithful servants of God since time began (cf. John 14:1-3). Not until after the Second Coming of Christ and the final Judgment will it become home for the faithful, both living and dead (Matthew 25:31-46;
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18).

The idea that Mary occupies a special place in heaven, close to the Son, is a tradition. It shows a lack of understanding concerning biblical teachings on the afterlife. In Luke 16:19-31, Jesus explained that the dead (saved and lost) go to a place called “hades” (16:23, Hebrew sheol)—a spiritual waiting place that separates the consolation of the righteous (referred to as “paradise,” cf. Luke 23:43) from the torment of the wicked. In hades, the righteous begin to taste part of the joy that awaits them in eternity, while the wicked begin to taste part of the suffering that awaits them. Hades is not the dwelling place of God; God dwells in heaven. Mary, along with Abraham and other faithful servants from the past, is waiting in hades until its dead are delivered up, when the Lord returns to judge each man and woman according to his or her works (Revelation 20:13). In this spiritual realm that precedes heaven, there is nothing that those who are there can do for those who are here (Luke 16:27-31).

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3271586/posts


52 posted on 03/28/2015 1:14:37 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet (You can help: https://www.tedcruz.org/donate/)
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To: stanne
]Luther’s]views of Mary as Mother of God and as ever-Virgin were identical to those in Catholicism

This is true, though it is a bit misleading.

Luther affirmed Mary as Theotokos, but θεοτόκος means "bearer of God," as opposed to θεομήτωρ, which AFAIK Luther never affirmed. All Christians believe Mary was the bearer of God, since God the Son was both borne by her and born from her, and that she was blessed by having received this gift.

It is also true that Luther himself believed that Mary was perpetually virgin, but that has not been the stance of Lutheran churches since. Here is the relevant pull quote from the LCMS:

"There has been some dispute regarding the relationship between Jesus and James, the natural interpretation being that James was the son of Mary and Joseph (thus a "half-brother" to Jesus). In the history of the Christian church, some believing in the perpetual virginity of Mary developed the view that Jesus and James were foster brothers, while others conjectured that they were cousins. LCMS theologians have found no difficulty with the view that Mary and Joseph themselves together had other children, including James." (http://www.lcms.org/Document.fdoc?src=lcm&id=546)

65 posted on 03/28/2015 1:56:13 PM PDT by chajin ("There is no other name under heaven given among people by which we must be saved." Acts 4:12)
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