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To: free_life

The resurrection is a main key. If, as in pre-tribulationism, the dead in Christ rise first at the rapture, then Revelation 20:5 is a lie.

In it is the sentence, “This is the first resurrection.”

When? Who? It is explained in verses 1 through 4. If pre-trib is correct, verse 5 should say, “This is the second resurrection.” Also, and a friend will be upset, all those who died before the tribulation do not reign with Messiah on earth. Also verse 5, “The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were completed.” This resurrection is everyone else ever born.

Phrases are very important, they should never be skipped. Every jot and tittle is there for a reason.


51 posted on 12/29/2014 1:33:23 AM PST by huldah1776
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To: huldah1776; wmfights; Iscool
The resurrection is a main key. If, as in pre-tribulationism, the dead in Christ rise first at the rapture, then Revelation 20:5 is a lie.

Part of the issue using Revelation 20:5 to determine timing of the translation (rapture), is that in Revelation 19, before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ we see the wedding feast with Christ.

Revelation 19:

6 And I heard, as it were, the voice of a great multitude, as the sound of many waters and as the sound of mighty thunderings, saying, “Alleluia! For the Lord God Omnipotent reigns! 7 Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.9 Then he said to me, “Write: ‘Blessed are those who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!’”

Then later in the same Chapter (Rev 19)

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war. 12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself. 13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses.

So just from the text of Revelation, if one takes it plainly, the marriage supper for the Bride and the marshalling of Christ's Army happen before He touches down to bring judgment as conquering King.

Now back to Revelation 20:

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Now literally taken, the above is taken as a very specific group. It is a group who had a direct dealing in not taking the mark, and were witnesses for Christ against the beast.

Then we have those who.. "But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished." Well, just in Revelation 19 Jesus did a lot of smiting and destroying of unbelievers and followers of the beast. So here in Revelation 20:5ff it is stated they stay dead until the 1,000 years are done. Then we see them again at the GWT judgment. It's all there in the chapter.

So putting aside pre/post trib flame wars, the Scripture tells us BEFORE Christ comes again as conquering King, He will have His bride with him "arrayed in fine linen."

Now Biblically speaking based on the above there are only three possibilites for the translation of the church.

1. Before the tribulation: based on the notion of not wrath but rapture

2. Mid trib: based on first 3.5 years of tribulation as opposed to 'The Great Tribulation' latter 3.5 years; and/or the timing of the last Trump (i.e. 7th of 7th Trumpet judgments).

3. It happens immediately before Christ's second coming. Meaning we meet Him in the air, we have the marriage supper, and then mount up and join Christ as part of his Second Coming host.

So really the "problem" of Revelation 20:5 resides with #3 above and not #2 or #1.

then Revelation 20:5 is a lie

Finally, the above is such a non-starter to a conversation. And no I am not a dispensationalist, but do see their view as the most consistent. What I mean about that is, they actually lay out logical event milestones. Where the Amils just hand wave as one whole event or allegory for the ages. Now the post-trib millennials have in recent years given some great effort and I do very much respect their approach. However, the sniping has to stop as we are The Body of Christ.

57 posted on 12/29/2014 9:08:32 AM PST by redleghunter (... we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God-Heb 4:14)
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