Posted on 08/19/2014 7:57:09 AM PDT by NKP_Vet
Bathsheba knowingly and willingly deceived Solomon and this is who Mary is modeled after???
And then Solomon refuses the 'Queens'' request and murders the one the Queen was pimping for...This is your Queen Mary??? Wow!!!!!!
1Ki 2:24 Now therefore, as the LORD liveth, which hath established me, and set me on the throne of David my father, and who hath made me an house, as he promised, Adonijah shall be put to death this day.
Why are you accusing rawcatslyentist of dis-honering Mary??? What has rawcatslyentist done to dis-honor Mary???
It's pretty well known that in all accepted lies, there's an element of truth...
THAT is worship...
It is said??? That's your proof??? It is also said that elephants hide in cherry trees...
In fact, on the way downtown from here there are two Mary statues in front of homes: We call them the "Big Mary" and the "Little Mary". Each usually gets a prayer but neither gets worship or misidentified as a deity.
No, even then.
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Why do you make that erroneous leap to think that in order to hear everyone's prayer requests, one would have to be omnipresent? One is not based upon the other, nor do they mean the same thing.
When the choir sings in your church, can you hear all of them singing, from all their different locations in the choir loft, or just one person among them in one location in that choir loft? Who gives you the ability to hear all of them at the same time? (For that matter, who is is that gives you the ability to hear just one other person, or to ever hear anything at all?)
It is God who gives you the ability to hear anything. Do you believe God is omnipotent? Do you believe God is powerful enough to enable a person to hear 100 people in different earthly locations at the same time? A thousand? Just where (at what number) do you think God's power ends in enabling (by His power) a human to hear different voices from different "earthly" places at the same "earthly" time?
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If a person falls into a stinky, slimy quicksand pit, and a kind person comes along and pulls that other person out of that pit, and saves that person's life, that person was saved.
Likewise, if that same kind person saw another person about to fall into that same stinky, slimy quicksand pit, and the kind person reached out and grabbed the other person's hand and prevented them from falling into that slimy pit, that person was also saved. One was saved before falling into the slime, and one was saved after falling into the slime. Both were saved.
This source puts it better:
Consider an analogy: Suppose a man falls into a deep pit, and someone reaches down to pull him out. The man has been "saved" from the pit. Now imagine a woman walking along, and she too is about to topple into the pit, but at the very moment that she is to fall in, someone holds her back and prevents her. She too has been saved from the pit, but in an even better way: She was not simply taken out of the pit, she was prevented from getting stained by the mud in the first place. This is the illustration Christians have used for a thousand years to explain how Mary was saved by Christ. By receiving Christ’s grace at her conception, she had his grace applied to her before she was able to become mired in original sin and its stain.
The Catechism of the Catholic Church states that she was "redeemed in a more exalted fashion, by reason of the merits of her Son" (CCC 492). She has more reason to call God her Savior than we do, because he saved her in an even more glorious manner!
Source:"Immaculate Conception and Assumption" - Catholic Answers
(I urge you to read the whole article. It is very enlightening.)
Oh I forget, it was Billy Bob and Marcel, from the 1st Baptist Church that really safeguarded Holy Scriptures and handscribed them into a readable Bible. Two thumbs up for Billy Bob and Marcel.
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That simply is not true.
If a protestant kneels before their open Bible and prays to God, are they worshipping the Bible?
Likewise, when a Catholic kneels to pray, or to ask a saint to pray with them and to pray intercessory prayers for them, (possibly using a picture or a statue to focus their mind and heart), they are not giving them the worship due only to God, but only great honor. Prayer to God is worship, prayer to fellow created beings like saints or guardian angels is not, and it does not take a great deal of discernment to be able to distinguish those two types of prayer.
God Himself gave Mary great honor. Out of all the human beings who have ever existed since the beginning of time, God only chose one single human being to bring Jesus Christ into this world in His humanity, and that special person was not you, and it was not me. It was Mary. God gave Mary the greatest honor ever given to any human being, the honor of bringing Jesus Christ into this human world in His humanity.
You can claim over and over and over again that the Catholic Church teaches the worship of Mary, but that is simply not true (and you must know where Jesus said all untruths come from).
From His cross, Jesus shared His own Mother with His disciple and with all of us:
When Jesus therefore saw His mother, and the disciple whom He loved standing by, He said to His mother, “Woman, behold your son!” Then He said to the disciple, “Behold your mother!”We should all honor our Mothers.
John 19:26-27
No, I didn’t say that. She is empowered by her son, Jesus Christ, Second Person of the Trinity and God the Father. All the power is from God.
In a counterfeit world, man can rationalize lies as having elements of truth so they are accepted.
but no lie leads to The Way, The Truth and The Life...
What she points to isn’t Truth..her testimony is false. Not on my opinion. But on His Word...
Proverbs 14:5 A faithful witness will not lie. But a false witness utters lies.
Proverbs 14:25 a true witness delivers souls, but he that utters lies causes deceit.
It should be pretty well known that the father of all lies is not interested in pointing to God’s Truth...deceit and counterfeits is his game.
Proving all things is a dangerous exercise that should be thought out completely before attempting.
It may change one’s entire worldview and have scriptures like ‘Satan deceives the whole world’ come clearly into view as prophetically occurring each and every day-especially in these last days..
Mother and daughter are united in much that, two years ago, I didn’t question. It was just givens.like 2+2....
Those givens are not givens anymore.. and by His grace, I see the world exactly as we should expect it to be with the father of all lies ruling here-counterfeit..
And greco roman latin mother and daughter churches are not immune to counterfeits..they are world leaders, sadly..
Number 14 on that list is either a lie or truth..half truth isn’t truth.. not when we are talking Holy.
If it is truth, then His Word is shown to be false..
If it is lies, then each believer has questions to ask themselves and their Heavenly Father..
Either His Word is Truth or ‘our lady’ is truth... they both cannot be.,
Catholics have made their choice-
Protestants may have made the same choice...
You need to do better than that...If you are standing on HollyWood and Vine, and your choir is singing its heart out in Yuma, Ariz., you ain't hearing nothing, unless you are omnipresent...And you're not and neither is anyone else in heaven except God...
No one prays to their bible like you guys pray to statues...
Actually it was God who safeguarded the scriptures and it was people like Billy Bob and Marcel who hand copied these books and spread them thru-out the world and into the churches...
"Chose" or "created"? I would re-write that to say:
"God created one single human being to bring Jesus Christ into this world"
I'm not a Catholic, just a low information, non-denominational Christian.
I see Mary before, during and after Jesus as unique among humans, but radically beyond the common man after Jesus' conception, and then again after His death, and again after hers. Each a level shift and all due to and for the absolute Glory and Grace of God.
From what I've read so far, I see Mary (Mother of God) as redeeming Eve (mother of man) and Eve's original sin and Jesus redeeming each and all of us sinners and our sins that flowed from that original sin.
I don't understand all of the math and how things fully balance thanks to Jesus and His Mother Mary (Mother of God!), but my sense is they are the reason the cosmic math equation can/will balance.
Regardless, just from a 10 Commandment point of view, I'd be very, very reluctant to dis Mary in any way, shape, manner or form.
Using Jeremiah to do this seems almost willfully confused, given the timeline, but like I confessed, my understanding is in the "Low Info" category and I'm seeking to be like a child in spirit.
As such, praying seems more like having a conversation and there is nothing wrong with calling Home and having a conversation with the Holy Family, including Mom.
You know you might be right. Given the syncretism that is rampant in the RCC, particularly in the under-developed world, I probably made an overstatement.
Prayer to God is worship, prayer to fellow created beings like saints or guardian angels is not, and it does not take a great deal of discernment to be able to distinguish those two types of prayer.
Actually, to accept your argument requires a total lack of discernment. How is this not a case of the logical fallacy of special pleading?
Of course, God gave Mary a great honor - no Protestant denies that. No Protestant has anything but admiration for Mary since she was God's selected hand-maiden. However, praise and honor are due to her son, not Mary. Anything that diminishes or draws attention away from the accomplishments of Jesus Christ, God's chosen Messiah, in redeeming His People gets into the area of false worship.
You can claim over and over and over again that the Catholic Church teaches the worship of Mary, but that is simply not true (and you must know where Jesus said all untruths come from).
You apparently have me confused with someone else. I only posted two previous comments to this thread, one of which said nothing about Mary veneration. I generally avoid these Catholic-Protestant spitting matches. If I have stated it 'over and over and over,' maybe because it is that the typical Catholic response is 'no, we don't.' Your assertion proves nothing, no matter how many times you say it.
Your John 19 reference proves nothing other than Jesus was concerned about His mother's earthly welfare and responsibly assigned her a specific guardian. While you're looking up special pleadings, you might want to brush up on the definition of eisegesis - you just provided a great example with your John 19 reference.
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