Posted on 01/28/2014 7:27:17 PM PST by NKP_Vet
"If a teaching isn’t explicit in the Bible, then we don’t accept it as doctrine!" That belief, commonly known as sola scriptura, was a central component of all I believed as a Protestant. This bedrock Protestant teaching claims that Scripture alone is the sole rule of faith and morals for Christians. Diving deeper into its meaning to defend my Protestant faith against Catholicism about twenty years ago, I found that there was no uniform understanding of this teaching among Protestant pastors and no book I could read to get a better understanding of it.
What role does tradition play? How explicit does something have to be in Scripture before it can be called doctrine? Does Scripture tell us what is absolutely essential for us to believe as Christians? How can we determine the canon using sola scriptura? All these questions and more pointed to the central question: Where is sola scriptura itself taught in the Bible?
(Excerpt) Read more at catholic.com ...
Why? It is just the definition of a particular eschatalogical interpretation (like dispensationalsim, historicism, etc).
Why is that offensive?
***
I wonder if Jesus needed one of these when he was out teaching and sharing His Word??
I was hoping you could tell me. For example, I believe this is Ezekiel prophesying on the destruction of Jerusalem:
"Then take of them again, and cast them into the midst of the fire, and burn them in the fire; for thereof shall a fire come forth into all the house of Israel. Thus saith the Lord God; This is Jerusalem: I have set it in the midst of the nations and countries that are round about her. And she hath changed my judgments into wickedness more than the nations, and my statutes more than the countries that are round about her: for they have refused my judgments and my statutes, they have not walked in them." (Eze 5:4-6 KJV)
Philip
>>>From that point of view, the problems I have with Preterism are that they claim all is done, which I am adamantly SURE is just factually impossible to believe<<<
I agree. It is not biblical. I don’t know how they came up with that one.
>>>and that it’s root comes heavily from the Protestant form of Replacement Theology, which as you probably already know, is something I must wholly reject - If not in and of itself, then for the nasty brand of anti-semitism which follows it everywhere.<<<
I have no idea what Replacement Theology is. I have heard it mentioned a few times during the few sermons of John Hagee that I braved. What is it?
Philip
>>>we ain’t going up to heaven, heaven is coming down here.<<<
Where did you get that notion?
It isn't quite that simple...
See Wikipedia:Christian Eschatology for an overview, and follow the links to dig down for Preterism, Historicism, Futurism, and Idealism and their links for an expanded view of each.
Catholics tend to be Preterist, hard core Reformed/Calvinists tend toward Partial Preterism, Baptist, Wesleyans, and other Protestants (and most Evangelicals) tend toward Futurism (Dispensationalism primarily), and wacko liberal protestants tend toward Idealism. None of that is written in stone, though some consider it almost creedal in position.
You have been here sense 2000 I join in 2001 was here earlier it was a completely different format and coloring.
I have never came across your handle before just wondering where you have been all this time?
I have asked a lot of questions and received very few answers
>>>I have never came across your handle before just wondering where you have been all this time?<<<
I have been very busy since about 2009: retirement, moving, new home, etc.. I was away from FR for several years, until recently.
Philip
Who was Peter and Jesus referring to in these passages?
"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ." (Acts 2:36 KJV)
"I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd." (John 10:14-16 KJV)
"These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand. Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give." (Mat 10:5-8 KJV)
"I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." (Mat 15:24 KJV)
Philip
it is another world than I grew up on when I was mainstream it was like kindergarten folks were so simple than they either were one or the other in all the faiths I was familiar with Protestants, Catholic, or Jewish.
In spite of the hard heads there was goodwill towards their neighbor not it like trying today to annihilate one another as I witness so often for dare to have a thought contrary to the Tradition, that has been handed down from century to century.
How about taking time to see the good...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIK25cozg0I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqAhREiKQGg
Well glad to see you have time sorry for the hornet nest I been buzz through now and than LOL
Now why do you think that all the scriptures have been full filled?
When as you see our nation, as well as the world is going through wicked turmoil, and every day is becoming more uncertain.
There is still much that has to come pass before the great and dreadful day of the Lord.
that was a real eye opener when you felt it has already happen, a lot of bad things have happen, but judgment day is an episode all unto it self yet to take place.
The scriptures testify to that!
We are now just witnessing a touch of what about to unfold, at least the opposition is trying to dazzle the world with it hi-tech bag of tricks.
But the power of the Lord is much greater than anything the light bearer will ever be able to unleash...
Wow! Calling me a liar in a post and not even a ping to me.
I don't believe that. I believe there is prophecy to be fulfilled.
>>>When as you see our nation, as well as the world is going through wicked turmoil, and every day is becoming more uncertain.<<<
That is the way I see it. It has all the hallmarks of Satan being loosed on the church. In the last half of the century alone, there has been a massive assault on the Church, and Christian morals in particular. Satan has corrupted the morality of our children, killed tens of millions of our babies, weakened our right to self defense, damaged our work ethic, and placed us in bondage with a blizzard of rules and regulations. Not just in our nation, but over the entire breadth of the earth. This is the scripture:
"And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city . . . " (Rev 20:7-9 KJV)
That is where we I think we are now. The breadth of the earth is, by definition, the entire earth. The beloved city is New Jerusalem, aka, the Church. The camp of the saints is on mount Sion, where the beloved city is located. As I said, Satan has been going after the Church. The church is public enemy #1 to him.
>>>There is still much that has to come pass before the great and dreadful day of the Lord.<<<
I believe that part of the scripture was fulfilled in the destruction of Jerusalem. Everything pointed to it, including Old and New Testament prophecy.
>>>that was a real eye opener when you felt it has already happen, a lot of bad things have happen, but judgment day is an episode all unto it self yet to take place. The scriptures testify to that!<<<
I believe Judgement day occurs shortly after Satan is finally defeated in (Rev 20:11-15.) This is the defeat of Satan:
". . . and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." (Rev 20:9-10 KJV)
Philip
>>>Wow! Calling me a liar in a post and not even a ping to me.<<<
I can never seem to remember to do that. It wasn’t personal.
>>>There were other Prophets of God that spoke of Elijah coming back and they pointed to the Messiah and His coming to earth.<<<
boatbums, you stated the above in this post to me. I am asking again: please provide me a list of those other prophets who spoke of Elijah.
thanks
Philip
Calling me a liar wasn’t personal?
Words such as "false" "error" "wrong" do not attribute motive.
Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.
How about Malachi for one
Malachi 4 At the Second Coming, the proud and wicked will be burned as stubble—Elijah will return before that great and dreadful day.
5 ¶Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:
6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
John 1
15 ¶John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.
17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
19 ¶And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou?
20 And he confessed, and denied not; but confessed, I am not the Christ.
21 And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No.
22 Then said they unto him, Who art thou? that we may give an answer to them that sent us. What sayest thou of thyself?
23 He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias.
24 And they which were sent were of the Pharisees.
25 And they asked him, and said unto him, Why baptizest thou then, if thou be not that Christ, nor Elias, neither that prophet?
26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;
27 He it is, who coming after me is preferred before me, whose shoe’s latchet I am not worthy to unloose.
28 These things were done in Bethabara beyond Jordan, where John was baptizing.
Excerpt JS-H http://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/js-h/1.38.38-39?lang=eng#37
33 He called me by name, and said unto me that he was a messenger sent from the presence of God to me, and that his name was Moroni; that God had a work for me to do; and that my name should be had for good and evil among all nations, kindreds, and tongues, or that it should be both good and evil spoken of among all people.
34 He said there was a book deposited, written upon gold plates, giving an account of the former inhabitants of this continent, and the source from whence they sprang. He also said that the fulness of the everlasting Gospel was contained in it, as delivered by the Savior to the ancient inhabitants;
35 Also, that there were two stones in silver bows—and these stones, fastened to a breastplate, constituted what is called the Urim and Thummim—deposited with the plates; and the possession and use of these stones were what constituted c“seers” in ancient or former times; and that God had prepared them for the purpose of translating the book.
36 After telling me these things, he commenced quoting the prophecies of the Old Testament. He first quoted part of the athird chapter of Malachi; and he quoted also the fourth or last chapter of the same prophecy, though with a little variation from the way it reads in our Bibles. Instead of quoting the first verse as it reads in our books, he quoted it thus:
37 For behold, the day cometh that shall burn as an oven, and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly shall burn as stubble; for they that come shall burn them, saith the Lord of Hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
38 And again, he quoted the fifth verse thus: Behold, I will reveal unto you the Priesthood, by the hand of Elijah the prophet, before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord.
39 He also quoted the next verse differently: And he shall plant in the hearts of the children the promises made to the fathers, and the hearts of the children shall turn to their fathers. If it were not so, the whole earth would be utterly wasted at his coming.
40 In addition to these, he quoted the eleventh chapter of Isaiah, saying that it was about to be fulfilled. He quoted also the third chapter of Acts, twenty-second and twenty-third verses, precisely as they stand in our New Testament. He said that that prophet was Christ; but the day had not yet come when “they who would not hear his voice should be cut off from among the people,” but soon would come.
John 1:21; JS—H 1:38 (38–39).
TG Last Days; Millennium,
Preparing a People for; Priesthood, Keys of.
Elijah ( the LDS believe that Elijah did appear at the Kirtland Temple April 3, 1836,
Jehovah is my God. Called “the Tishbite,” but the meaning of this name is quite uncertain, no place being known from which it could be derived. He was “of the inhabitants of Gilead,” the wild and beautiful hill country east of Jordan. The nature of the district and the lonely life that men lived there produced its full effect on the character of the prophet. Nothing is known of his parentage. The northern kingdom was the scene of his work, at a time when, owing to the influence of Ahab and Jezebel, the people had almost entirely forsaken the worship of Jehovah and had become worshippers of the Phoenician god Baal (1 Kgs. 16:32; 18:19). An account of Elijah’s life is found in 1 Kgs. 17–22; 2 Kgs. 1–2 and 2 Chr. 21:12–15; there are also the following references to him in the New Testament: Matt. 16:14; 17:3; 27:47–49; Mark 6:14–15; 9:4; 15:35–36; Luke 4:25–26; 9:30; James 5:17.
The deep impression Elijah made upon the life of the Israelites is indicated in the fixed belief that prevails that he will return, as spoken of in Mal. 4:5. The foregoing references from the New Testament show that many mistook Jesus for Elijah returned. Among the Jews he is still an invited guest at the Passover, for whom a vacant seat is reserved and the door is opened.
His recorded words are few but forceful, and his deeds are explicit evidences of his strength of will, force of character, and personal courage. He was an example of solid faith in the Lord. With his ministry are associated such colorful events as his pronouncements upon the life and death of Ahab and Jezebel (and their subsequent fulfillment); calling down fire from heaven; sealing the heavens with no rain for 3½ years; blessing the widow’s meal and oil; and raising a boy from the dead. His life closed dramatically: “there appeared a chariot of fire, … and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven,” (2 Kgs. 2:11–12) and thus was he translated. As a result of Elijah’s ministry, Baal worship was greatly reduced as a threat to Israel. At his translation Elijah’s mantle (shawl) fell on Elisha, his successor; the term “mantle of the prophet” has become a phrase indicative of prophetic succession.
We learn from latter-day revelation that Elijah held the sealing power of the Melchizedek Priesthood. He appeared on the Mount of Transfiguration in company with Moses (also translated) and conferred the keys of the priesthood on Peter, James, and John (Matt. 17:3).
He appeared again, in company with Moses and others, on April 3, 1836, in the Kirtland (Ohio) Temple and conferred the same keys upon Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery. All of this was in preparation for the coming of the Lord, as spoken of in Mal. 4:5–6 (D&C 110:13–16). As demonstrated by his miraculous deeds, the power of Elijah is the sealing power of the priesthood by which things bound or loosed on earth are bound or loosed in heaven. Thus the keys of this power are once again operative on the earth and are used in performing all the ordinances of the gospel for the living and the dead.
I know many will scoff at this but Elijah has return April 3, 1836 to give the keys for the sealing power of the priesthood by which things bound or loosed on earth are bound or loosed in heaven.
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