Posted on 01/12/2014 5:53:46 AM PST by knarf
You don't need a priest, or sacraments, or a "church", or a denomination, or charismatic 'gifts' or baptism or hierarchal permission, sanction nor absolution ...
You know because the Catholic Church confirmed what was Scripture and what was not.
Yet it was the same Church that gave the world THE BIBLE.
Silly me. I thought God gave us his Word.
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I know I’m goona regret jumping in this pool but here goes.
“the Word” that was made flesh was Jesus.
The Bible, which comes from Latin meaning “books” is what the Catholic Church gave to the world.
Oh and the word “Bible” is no where in “The Bible” for the record.
Of course they don't understand it because they don't understand what the new birth is about; what getting a new heart and a new mind is like and the transformation that occurs within when that happens.
They don't know what it's like to have the mind of Christ or to have their minds transformed by renewal ala Romans 12:2
You can tell them until you're blue in the face about the changed heart but until they have one, they don't get it. They CAN'T get it.
So with carnal minds and carnal thinking, they conclude that just because someone receives a gift as great as eternal life, someone will automatically take it and run with it to live a life of licentiousness because that is what THEY'd do. It's called projecting.
It seems to be beyond their comprehension that the saved person would NOT want to do that and that those who think that way are not really saved.
Show us Scriptural support for your claims.
What gift of the Spirit is it that you are claiming to be exercising?
NO!
Placeholder
Same as Jesus. Not so sad.
“Your ancestors ate the manna in the desert, but they died;
this is the bread that comes down from heaven so that one may eat it and not die.
I am the living bread that came down from heaven; whoever eats this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give is my flesh for the life of the world.”
The Jews quarreled among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us (his) flesh to eat?”
Jesus said to them, “Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day.
For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.
Just as the living Father sent me and I have life because of the Father, so also the one who feeds on me will have life because of me.
This is the bread that came down from heaven. Unlike your ancestors who ate and still died, whoever eats this bread will live forever.”
These things he said while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum
Then many of his disciples who were listening said, “This saying is hard; who can accept it?”
Since Jesus knew that his disciples were murmuring about this, he said to them, “Does this shock you?
What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?
It is the spirit that gives life, while the flesh is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life.
But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him.
And he said, “For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by my Father.”
As a result of this, many (of) his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him
Jesus then said to the Twelve, “Do you also want to leave?”
Simon Peter answered him, “Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.
We have come to believe and are convinced that you are the Holy One of God.”
Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you twelve? Yet is not one of you a devil?”
He was referring to Judas, son of Simon the Iscariot; it was he who would betray him, one of the Twelve.” [John 6: 49-71]
Sure we do because God said so and we know what He is trustworthy.
I don't believe because man told me so. I believe because God told me so. That's called *faith* and we walk by faith, not by sight.
Anyone who has to have physical confirmation of spiritual truth to trust God is not walking by faith. And without faith, it is IMPOSSIBLE to please God because the one who comes to Him must believe that He is and He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.
And the mind of God.
Awesome....
Too bad for the thief on the cross.
It's not like HE had time to live a life that showed his faith and God's saving grace working in his life.
I guess that Jesus was wrong about him then, eh?
“I know I’m goona regret jumping in this pool but here goes.
“the Word” that was made flesh was Jesus.
The Bible, which comes from Latin meaning “books” is what the Catholic Church gave to the world.
Oh and the word “Bible” is no where in “The Bible” for the record.”
If you spent just a few minutes actually testing the claims of Roman Catholicism, on both a historical and scriptural level, then you wouldn’t make such silly elementary mistakes like this. The RCC’s claims are a mile wide but an inch deep.
As is so often the case, reading a popular “proof text” in context rather than by itself answers your question.
John 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world, to judge the world, but that the world may be saved by him.
John 3:18 He that believeth in him is not judged. But he that doth not believe, is already judged : because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
John 3:19 And this is the judgment : because the light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than the light : for their works were evil.
John 3:20 For every one that doth evil hateth the light, and cometh not to the light, that his works may not be reproved.
John 3:21 But he that doth truth, cometh to the light, that his works may be made manifest, because they are done in God.
Notice ”is already judged” in 18 with the judgment spelled out in 19. Those who are judged are judged by their own love of darkness rather than light because their deeds are evil and those who come to the light come so their works are made manifest because they are done in God.
Grace allows us to come to the light by inspiring Faith in us and Faith always manifests itself as Christ, who can only do good, working in and through us. Grace is not made manifest by Christ hanging around while we go on doing our own thing as we "feel led" by whatever convenient spirit pretending to be the Holy Spirit manages to get our attention from one minute to the next.
There is no separation between our belief and our works.
It's not a question of "taking a baseball bat" to a gift, it's a question of accepting the gift as opposed to just admitting the gift exists. The Grace of God is a gift that possesses you, not something you park in the driveway for when you want to use it or can have lying around to beat with a bat or ignore until you want it to chase a Frisbee you toss around.
Hebrews 9:1-28 NASB
Now even the first covenant had regulations of divine worship and the earthly sanctuary. For there was a tabernacle prepared, the outer one, in which were the lampstand and the table and the sacred bread; this is called the holy place. Behind the second veil there was a tabernacle which is called the Holy of Holies, having a golden altar of incense and the ark of the covenant covered on all sides with gold, in which was a golden jar holding the manna, and Aaron’s rod which budded, and the tables of the covenant; and above it were the cherubim of glory overshadowing the mercy seat; but of these things we cannot now speak in detail.
Now when these things have been so prepared, the priests are continually entering the outer tabernacle performing the divine worship, but into the second, only the high priest enters once a year, not without taking blood, which he offers for himself and for the sins of the people committed in ignorance. The Holy Spirit is signifying this, that the way into the holy place has not yet been disclosed while the outer tabernacle is still standing, which is a symbol for the present time. Accordingly both gifts and sacrifices are offered which cannot make the worshiper perfect in conscience, since they relate only to food and drink and various washings, regulations for the body imposed until a time of reformation.
But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things to come, He entered through the greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this creation; and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption. For if the blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkling those who have been defiled sanctify for the cleansing of the flesh, how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? For this reason He is the mediator of a new covenant, so that, since a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.
For where a covenant is, there must of necessity be the death of the one who made it. For a covenant is valid only when men are dead, for it is never in force while the one who made it lives. Therefore even the first covenant was not inaugurated without blood. For when every commandment had been spoken by Moses to all the people according to the Law, he took the blood of the calves and the goats, with water and scarlet wool and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book itself and all the people, saying, “T his is the blood of the covenant which G od commanded you .”
And in the same way he sprinkled both the tabernacle and all the vessels of the ministry with the blood. And according to the Law, one may almost say, all things are cleansed with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no forgiveness. Therefore it was necessary for the copies of the things in the heavens to be cleansed with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ did not enter a holy place made with hands, a mere copy of the true one, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us; nor was it that He would offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the holy place year by year with blood that is not his own.
Otherwise, He would have needed to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now once at the consummation of the ages He has been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment, so Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time for salvation without reference to sin, to those who eagerly await Him.
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Ask Yeshua.
Matthew 10
[22] And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Matthew 24:
[11] And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
[12] And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
[13] But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Rev 2:
[26] And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
He makes it clear that some perseverance on our part is going to be required.
Where do we find the strength?
What is it that lets us know when we fail?
John 14:16 And I will pray the Father and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever-
Our works, perseverance, willingness to hold up under persecution are a reflection of what is already done. If someone falls short does the Holy Spirit disappear?
Well as you pointed out previously the passage is taken out of context. Jesus was not speaking of an infallible assembly or its leaders but how to deal with unrepentant brothers:
Matthew 18:15-20 NASB
“If your brother sins , go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed . If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.
Truly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven. “Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst.”
Isaiah 1:3 KJV
The ox knoweth his owner, and the ass his master’s crib: but Israel doth not know, my people doth not consider.
Isaiah 1:18-22 KJV
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord : though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool. If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land: But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it. How is the faithful city become an harlot! it was full of judgment; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers. Thy silver is become dross, thy wine mixed with water:
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