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To: Zionist Conspirator; redleghunter; editor-surveyor
You chrstians absolutely refuse to even think about this, don't you?

Oh, I have thought about it endlessly... To the point of throwing the religion of my youth upon the altar to see what survived the flame, which was dang little, btw... Strip it ALL away and prove first that YHWH IS GOD... And follow with the rest.

When the "new testament" says that J*sus "fulfilled" this or that prophecy, it is interpreting the Hebrew Bible.

TRUE.

You have never even wondered whether it has the authority to do so because you have always just assumed that it did.

That is not true.

If the "new testament" is in fact a fraud, then it does not have the authority to declare J*sus as the fulfillment of this or that "messianic prophecy." And if J*sus was a fraud, then he didn't have the authority to declare this or that act a "fulfillment of messianic prophecy."

True - But the Brit is not a fraud - nor is Yeshua... The fraud perpetuated was what folks DID with it.

Jews go by the Torah because they were given the Torah at Sinai.

No, The Jews destroy Torah by way of their traditions - Just as the Christians do after them.

You don't accept the "old testament" because you received it from G-d.

Anyone who accepts Torah receives it from God, or both you and I would be lost - That the Hebrews heard it shouted down from Sinai means nothing if those who come after cannot receive it.

You accept it only on the "authority" of the "new testament."

That would be silly. As far as the written word, the evidential authority of YHWH IS Torah. ALL that comes thereafter depends upon it - This is something you would probably admit readily, and I share your frustration in that regard. There is no authority for the Brit Hadasha without the Tanakh - and the authority of the Tanakh is the Torah. Systemically, the foundation is necessary to the following parts... That much is glaringly obvious, no?

But never mind. You won't even consider a word I've said because you "know" the "new testament" is divinely inspired by the same G-d Who gave the Torah. You have absolutely no reason whatsoever to assume this (you've just decided to do so), but that won't stop you.

The proof is in the Prophets, as always.

82 posted on 03/19/2014 8:36:32 AM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)
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To: roamer_1
The proof is in the Prophets, as always.

But why do you believe J*sus and the "new testament" fulfilled those prophecies? Why do you even believe those prophecies are "messianic" prophecies at all?

Simple--you accept the "new testament" from the outset. When it says a certain prophecy is "messianic" you believe it. When it says J*sus fulfilled such and such a prophecy you believe it. But why? Why do you believe the "new testament" is trustworthy and authoritative? You basically "prove" your argument by simply assuming it from the get-go. This is illogical. But I have pointed this out so many times and had it ignored just as many, so it is obvious that no chrstian wants to deal with this at all.

By stating that every "believer" "accepts" the Torah you completely misunderstand the concept of national revelation. Only Israel received this, so only the Torah given at Sinai (and not anything that followed) is provable.

Among the "traditions" you attack are the vowels and punctuation in the Torah, which in its written form consists only of a string of over 300,000 consonants. Perhaps those vowels and punctuation marks are "doctrines and commandments of men" and should be removed?

Your attack on the Oral Torah comes from the critique given in the "new testament." For the zillionth time, what gives the "new testament" the right to do this? Why is it hard-wired into your brain that "the bible" consists of the Protestant canon? How in the world is this self-evident?

I know . . . because the "new testament" says it is, and the "new testament" is the "word of G-d" so it must be true. You don't even see how you reason in a circle, do you?

I can't believe I once used to think like this. It's ridiculous.

83 posted on 03/19/2014 9:51:55 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (The Left: speaking power to truth since Shevirat HaKelim.)
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