Is Jesus Christ God?

Christian Answers ^ | 2012 | Various

[DouglasKC]

“The Christian faith has not been tried and found wanting. It has rather been found difficult and left untried.” —Chesterton

I am the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending.The story of Jesus is either the greatest event in history or the cruelest hoax. If it is a hoax, then the whole of the Christian message crumbles together with the hopes of those multitudes of lives built on his name. The apostle Paul said:

“And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty. Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up; if in fact the dead do not rise. For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen. And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins! Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished. If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable.” -1 Corinthians 15:14-19 (NKJV)

But if the story is true, then this world has been hit with extraordinary news of earth-shaking consequences. Have you taken the trouble to decide which it is?

In a matter this weighty, it is in your interest to explore the truth or falsity of Christ's claims. Amazingly however, many people who don't believe have never bothered to explore the evidence in support of Jesus,[1] but to the contrary, often run away from it. At the same time, many Christians themselves are not sure, at bottom, whether the claims of their faith are solid. Is the Christian claim a hoax? Is it just wishful thinking? Or is it actually true?

[tedw]

In “The New Catholic Encyclopedia” (Bearing the Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur, indicating official approval) we get a glimpse of how the concept of the Trinity was not introduced into Christianity until close to four hundred years after Jesus (pbuh):

“.......It is difficult in the second half of the 20th century to offer a clear, objective and straightforward account of the revelation, doctrinal evolution, and theological elaboration of the Mystery of the trinity. Trinitarian discussion, Roman Catholic as well as other, present a somewhat unsteady silhouette. Two things have happened. There is the recognition on the part of exegetes and Biblical theologians, including a constantly growing number of Roman Catholics, that one should not speak of Trinitarianism in the New Testament without serious qualification. There is also the closely parallel recognition on the part of historians of dogma and systematic theologians that when one does speak of an unqualified Trinitarianism, one has moved from the period of Christian origins to, say, the last quadrant of the 4th century. It was only then that what might be called the definitive Trinitarian dogma ‘One God in three Persons’ became thoroughly assimilated into Christian life and thought ... it was the product of 3 centuries of doctrinal development” (emphasis added).

“The New Catholic Encyclopedia” Volume XIV, p. 295.

They admit it!. Jesus’ twelve apostles lived and died never having heard of any “Trinity” !

Did Jesus leave his closest and dearest followers so completely and utterly baffled and lost that they never even realized the “true” nature of God? Did he leave them in such black darkness that neither they nor their children, nor yet their children’s children would ever come to recognize the “true” nature of the One they are to worship? Do we really want to allege that Jesus was so thoroughly incompetent in the discharge of his duties that he left his followers in such utter chaos that it would take them fully three centuries after his departure to finally piece together the nature of the One whom they are to worship? Why did Jesus never, even once, just say “God, the Holy Ghost and I are three Persons in one Trinity. Worship all of us as one”? If he had only chosen to make just one such explicit statement to them he could have relieved Christianity of centuries of bitter disputes, division, and animosity.

[boatbums]

No mere man or created being could have made that perfect sacrifice for our sins. Only God the Son, taking on human flesh and human nature, the Spotless Lamb, could do this. As another theologian had put it, the conflict over man’s sins was taken up into the Trinity itself.

Amen! That is the amazing part of the amazing grace of God. It is like a man being hauled before the judge after being found guilty of a serious crime. The judge pronounces the penalty the man must pay to satisfy his debt to society and then the judge stands up, takes off his robe and steps down to the clerk's desk and pays the fine out of his own pocket. The guilty man deserved the penalty, but the judge showed both justice AND mercy by not ignoring the seriousness of the crime yet making propitiation for the guilty.

Scripture repeatedly says we have ALL sinned and fall short of the perfection of God, that there is NONE righteous and that the "wages" (payment) for sin is DEATH. It is because of this that we cannot save ourselves - we would spend eternity separated from God because of our sins. But, in His grace, the Son of God humbled Himself and took on flesh, lived a perfect and sinless life and died IN OUR PLACE making satisfaction for the sins of the world. ONLY God is without sin - with man it is impossible because even one sin makes us guilty of the whole law. That is how we can KNOW that Jesus IS the incarnate God - something He promised all the way back in the garden to Adam and Eve when he cast them out. The very act of covering their nakedness with the skins of animals was demonstrating that without the shedding of blood, there is no remission of sins.

We celebrate the birth of our Savior, Jesus Christ, and rejoice that over two thousand years ago:

And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night. And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid. And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people. For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes, lying in a manger. And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying,

Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men. (Luke 2:8-14)

[Cvengr]

1st Timothy 3:16 , “...God was manifest in the flesh...”
Joh 1:14
(14) And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

---

Matthew 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

And there came a fear on all: and they glorified God, saying, That a great prophet is risen up among us; and, That God hath visited his people. Luke 7:16

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1:1

Joh 1:14
(14) And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. John 1:18

Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. John 5:18

I and my Father are one. John 10:30

The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. John 10:33

Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am. John 13:13

Jesus said to him, “...He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say, `Show us the Father?’” John 14:9

And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. John 17:5

And Thomas answered and said unto him [Jesus], My Lord and my God. John 20:28

...lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2Corinthians 4:4

...Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: Philippians 2:5,6

...after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. Colossians 2:9

God was manifest in the flesh... 1 Timothy 3:16

...our Lord Jesus Christ: Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; 1st Timothy 6:14,15

God...Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son... Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person... Hebrews 1:1-3

But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever... Hebrews 1:8

...the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Titus 2:13

Simon Peter... through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ: 2nd Peter 1:1

1Jn 4:2
(2) Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Revelation 1:8

And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. Revelation 19:16

[redleghunter]

If you are going to reference one verse from the NET Bible commentary, use the rest as well within context. They explain quite nicely the verse you think is difficulty.

Is it a habit to switch bible versions to find the most pliable to your view?

[Kevmo]

1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
***Hmmmm, the same verse at the top of this thread where heretics are operating in the open but complaining about getting resultantly spanked.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3069049/posts?page=2292

[Cvengr]

JWs are a cult because the deny the deity of Christ Jesus.
A good analysis is available from Walter Martin’s “Kingdom of the Cults”.

The Deity of Christ Jesus is inescapable now and at the future Judgment Seat.

A brief set of Scriptural evidence is provided in numerous posts here, and in post 543.

Once provided this doctrine, those who adamantly reject it simply manifest the spirit of antiChrist and are enemies of Christ.

[redleghunter]

Two points. First, you answered why no Roman Catholics post on this thread.

Second point Jesus did say this;

Luke 24:44-45 NASB

Now He said to them, “These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.” Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures,

[Kevmo]

We are dealing with brainwashed people
***Umm, perhaps this is “making it personal”?

[Kevmo]

dude, you’re replying to yourself and then replying AGAIN to yourself upthread, with a comment that those who disagree with you are brainwashed. Such comments deserve to be removed.

[Kevmo]

Those who deny who Jesus is are denying Him.
***Yup.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3069049/posts?page=2292

“Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son” (1 John 2:22).

[Kevmo]

We are dealing with brainwashed people who absolutely refuse to see.
***talking to yourself, and insulting those around you, making it personal by calling them “brainwashed”.

I think your post will soon be deleted by the RM.

[Kevmo]

Please do not lie about me...
***Where is the lie? The Religion Moderator would be no doubt be very interested.

you know very sell that I have indeed debated openly. You do not control the debate though. If you are going to ask non pertinent question to tbd
***Perhaps you should slow your typing down so we can understand it.

very simple debate and fact that the son is simply that , the son and our savior...then there is no need for me to answer those questions.
***There is plenty of need for you to answer such questions because they relate to the identity of the Most Important Person in History. If you can’t defend your views, then refrain from posting on such threads.

You are the one acting super pious and not mature. Thank you.
***Oh dernblatt. It would appear that your entire post is about to be removed by the Religion Moderator.

[Iscool]

But what is the use? You will not see!!

I have posted plenty of scripture that you refuse to comment on...And we know why, don't we???

The Holy Spirit is a Lord...Scripture was shown for that...
God is a Lord...Scripture was shown for that...And then there is this one:

Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

This is Jesus...The Lord of Lords...

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Reign with who??? God or Christ???

Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

Now who is sitting on the Throne??? God or Christ??? Here's a clue...Jeremiah chapter 4 (It is God)...

Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

Now, who is sitting on the Throne???

Here's a hint...

Joh_5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

So God is sitting on the Great White Throne but he doesn't judge anyone...It is Jesus sitting there on the Throne doing the judging...

Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Who is the tabernacle (temple), Jesus or God???

Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

Don't ya hate it when the bible does that???

Rev 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

Gettin' a picture yet???

Rev 22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.

There is only one Throne...

Rev 22:3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Serve God???

Rev 22:4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.

See whose face, God's???

Exo 33:20 And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live.

Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root (God> and the (Jesus)offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

[redleghunter]

Good post. Take a look at Ephesians 1. Explains the delineation of the Godhead.

I have to admit the Orthodox Study Bible has a great breakdown of this chapter. Sovereignty of The Father, Redemptive Work of Christ and Faithfulness of the Holy Spirit. One can only come to two logical conclusions reading Ephesians 1. One conclusion is there are three Gods, or three Divine Persons yet One God. We know from other Scriptural evidence the former cannot be true, leaving us with the latter, which is the orthodox (small “o”) understanding.

[Cvengr]

I’ve noticed how those who subscribe to cults, parrot the talking points of their teachers. There seems to be a trend in labeling believers who doctrinally understand the Trinity, as being “Brainwashed”. I wonder which cult leaders routinely use that label.

[redleghunter]

Check this out. Loads to choose from. I noticed one group on the list discouraged followers from engaging in logical debate, to use prepared answers and when challenged tell people they are liars. Sounds familiar.

http://www.spiritual-research-network.com/f/falseviewsofjesus_compilationlist.pdf

[Kevmo]

Jesus has some requirements...not to judge and for us to forgive as we are forgiven..
***That same Jesus had some very harsh words for false teachers such as yourself: ‘vipers’, ‘wolves in sheep’s clothing’, and ‘sons of their father the devil’. I have no doubt that you would consider Jesus’s words as unChristlike.

[tedw]

Lets see. You can call people “cult members” and that is not personal, but if someone calls you “brainwashed” that is.

Do I have that right?

Brainwashing is a pretty well defined practice and a lot of what goes on in Churches could rightly be described that way. That is not personal but an objective fact.

[Kevmo]

Trinitarians can’t really sucessully argue the Trinitarian point of view as it doesn’t hold up to scrutiny by honest seeking persons.
***And no doubt, you consider yourself to be honest. But you dishonestly and blithely ignore this evidence:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3104583/posts

[Gene Eric]

>> Therefore,it is impossible for Jesus to have been God as he was seen by many.

>> We are dealing with brainwashed people who absolutely refuse to see.

Yet you were not once a man, but think you are now.