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To: dartuser

Here is another lesson: http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/books/immortality_resurrection/6.htm

If you don’t want to read the whole thing, just search: “5. The Witness of Revelation” and start reading there. He covers your argument. No need for me to re-invent the wheel here.


105 posted on 12/16/2013 6:51:46 PM PST by cuban leaf
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To: cuban leaf; dartuser
Let me take just one example from that site. The author makes this comment about 2 Thess 1:9.

“When it comes to the punishment of the wicked, "unending" simply means"until they are destroyed."

Well, let’s look at the Greek words used in that passage.

2 Thess 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting (aiónios) destruction (olethros) from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Let’s look at the Greek words used there.

Aiónios - eternal, unending

olethros - ("ruination") however does not imply "extinction" (annihilation). Rather it emphasizes the consequent loss that goes with the complete "undoing."

Now, if you put the meaning of those two words together we can see that there is indeed unending ruination. Put together with other passages in scripture and we can understand there is unending torment or suffering

I would caution you.

2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

107 posted on 12/16/2013 7:36:56 PM PST by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
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To: cuban leaf
Ah yes ... I knew the Apocrypha had to come in there somewhere ...
127 posted on 12/17/2013 6:41:01 AM PST by dartuser
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To: cuban leaf
I also find it noteworthy that the main passage argued is "who can destroy both body and soul in hell" ...

Are you going to appeal to a lexical study that understands the symantic range of 'destroy' in several ways ... like you did for 'eternal?' ...

I suspect not.

128 posted on 12/17/2013 6:45:13 AM PST by dartuser
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To: cuban leaf
Another major blunder in the analysis ...

Second, as John Stott rightly points out, "The fire itself is termed ‘eternal’ and ‘unquenchable,’ but it would be very odd if what is thrown into it proves indestructible. Our expectation would be the opposite: it would be consumed for ever, not tormented for ever. Hence it is the smoke (evidence that the fire has done its work) which ‘rises for ever and ever’

The Greek text does nothing to support the notion that the smoke is the main focus here ... for the very next verse is the focus ... the result of the smoke of their torment ... ??

"they have no rest day and night" ...

The assertions and appeals to telelogical arguments instead of sound Biblical exegesis reveals that your position is not just unsound ... its heretical.

You have departed from a Biblical understanding of who God is ... and have substituted a god fashioned to your own liking ...

130 posted on 12/17/2013 6:51:54 AM PST by dartuser
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