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To: boatbums
"Nope...they were just as wrong and misled as your Brigham Young followers were at the Mountain Meadows Massacre. (I warned you before about throwing those stones from glass houses.)"

You're throwing lent balls. There's no comparison. MMM a single event and was not caused by religious bias. Nor was it sanctioned by the Church. "Christianity" however has 1800 yrs of blood on it's hands. Wars and inquisitions all in the name of God.

My spouse is a direct descendent of Bishop David Evans who was gunned down in his field by a mob which included three protestant ministers at Haun's Mill.

"We don't need a "prophet" today to tell us what Scripture means because we HAVE the Holy Spirit."

The Holy Spirit testifies of truth and can teach, true. But, who are you to say you don't need a prophet? God sends His servants and you reject them outright because you have your Bible?

John 5:39
38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.

39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.


The scriptures only get you so far. It's the servants of God that have the authority to act in His name.

Luke 13:
34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!


The Lord didn't send a herd of Bibles in to try to recover Jerusalem. He sent prophets.

Luke 13: 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.


These people the Lord is referring to, call Him Lord. They are believers and He casts them out at the judgement. Notice it doesn't say anything about a Bible or scriptures as the reason they will be cast out. The cause of their weeping and gnashing of teeth is seeing all the prophets. The ones they rejected.

"But there are some points where there is liberty and not everything is cut and dried for every person. On the MAJOR things - the tenets that comprise what Christianity IS - there is a genuine unity, even across denominational lines."

A false doctrine is a false doctrine. A couple centuries ago people were being slaughtered by the tens of thousands, tortured to death, over infant baptism. The only reason they stopped killing each other was because genocide became unpopular.

-Continued
190 posted on 12/06/2013 12:56:41 PM PST by StormPrepper
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To: StormPrepper
You're throwing lent balls. There's no comparison. MMM a single event and was not caused by religious bias. Nor was it sanctioned by the Church. "Christianity" however has 1800 yrs of blood on it's hands. Wars and inquisitions all in the name of God. My spouse is a direct descendent of Bishop David Evans who was gunned down in his field by a mob which included three protestant ministers at Haun's Mill.

I already told you that the horrible actions of sinful men - even if they do these acts under the impression that they are fighting FOR God - does not justify them nor, however, does it necessarily disprove the faith they say they are following. We know radical Muslims do things that are horrific and many other Muslims disapprove of their actions insisting that Islam is a "religion of peace". Can we look at their scriptures and determine which side is correct?

I can completely disapprove of the actions the Roman Catholic Church took during the Inquisitions and other persecutions they did under the false assumption that they were defending the faith against heretics. Even some Protestants did some of the same things and they were BOTH wrong. The truth of the gospel doesn't need the force of the sword of men to be preserved as God is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him. Man will NEVER be able to fight against God - His will and purpose will not be thwarted.

The Holy Spirit testifies of truth and can teach, true. But, who are you to say you don't need a prophet? God sends His servants and you reject them outright because you have your Bible? The scriptures only get you so far. It's the servants of God that have the authority to act in His name. The Lord didn't send a herd of Bibles in to try to recover Jerusalem. He sent prophets.

It seems that your definition of a "prophet" is different than mine. The Prophets God used to reveal the truth to mankind were hand selected and His words were relayed through them. Often, the people rejected them, persecuted them and killed them, and they answered to God for their actions. These "holy men of God" spoke as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit and EVERY word they spoke was directly from God. However, there came a time where there were no longer prophets in the land. We read in Lamentations, Zechariah, 2 Chronicles and other books that God removed His prophets from among the people because of their disobedience. There weren't anymore until Christ came to earth and God again breathed His word to selected people who, in turn, wrote down God's truth - just as they did in the time before Christ - which was copied and disbursed throughout the local churches.

If, instead of prophets, who specifically received divine revelation and communicated God's word to His people, you are speaking of those people who God has given the gift of "prophecy", then we are speaking of two different kinds of prophets. There were indeed believers in the churches who God used to speak forth the truth on what God had ALREADY revealed. They expounded upon and taught the believers to grow in grace, in their faith and in their knowledge of the truth. They did not reveal new truths or come up with novel interpretations of God's truth. They were led by the Holy Spirit - and their disciples also - to teach what God desired all Christians to know. One things that separated them from the numerous false prophets that existed even back then was the Holy Scriptures. They remained the authority by which all truth claims were, and are, to be measured.

These people the Lord is referring to, call Him Lord. They are believers and He casts them out at the judgement. Notice it doesn't say anything about a Bible or scriptures as the reason they will be cast out. The cause of their weeping and gnashing of teeth is seeing all the prophets. The ones they rejected.

Why presume they are "believers"? Jesus, when speaking about those false prophets who would come and to try and deceive His sheep, said:

Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!

If you notice, He says He NEVER knew them. Not that they were once His sheep but they strayed, but they were NEVER His sheep. We enter through the narrow gate - which is faith in Jesus Christ as Savior. The gate is NOT going to be Joseph Smith, Jr., or Mohammad, a Pope, Krishna, Buddha, or any prophet.

A false doctrine is a false doctrine. A couple centuries ago people were being slaughtered by the tens of thousands, tortured to death, over infant baptism. The only reason they stopped killing each other was because genocide became unpopular.

You're throwing your own "lent balls" now? The way we can know false doctrines or false prophets is by comparing them to God's holy word. It is our touchstone, our authority and rule of faith.

192 posted on 12/06/2013 2:27:58 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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