“We use different terminology, and view the thing from the standpoint of a more sophisticated, more mature, and deeper understanding of theology.
Signing on to the Protestant understanding of ”born again and Spirit filled” is several steps backward in spiritual and intellectual development.”
Wow, well aren’t you just the smartest boy in the class?!
No, I do not think you are born again, dsc.....no believer would speak like that to a fellow believer. There is the Catholic arrogance and looking down the nose at anyone outside of its walls in all its glory.
You just gave away what you truly are, dsc....a Catholic snob. lol
It takes absolutely no sophistication or great intellect at all to understand the simple message of the Gospel...even a little child can understand. Seems that is the kind of thing the Pharisees might have said of Peter or any of the other disciples they did not consider sophisticated or intellectual enough to follow Jesus. But Jesus did not choose those who thought themselves smarter or more knowledgeable. He chose simple men....men who could be taught His simple truths. Not a Pharisee among them until Joseph of Arimathea.
I stand by what I said before...no true believer stays in a Catholic church once born again.
Thanks for your comment.
I think a child could grasp a few words in this passage
19Then he took a loaf of bread; and when he had thanked God for it, he broke it in pieces and gave it to the disciples, saying, “This is my body, given for you. Do this in remembrance of me.” 20After supper he took another cup of wine and said, “This wine is the token of God’s new covenant to save you—an agreement sealed with the blood I will pour out for you.
Remembrance, Token, and Covenant. This is symbolic just as The Passover observance after The Exodus was a symbolic observance and remembrance. Jesus Christ is where He is asked to be and welcomed. Christ said where two or more gather in His name he is also there. People tend to think of Christ staying in heaven but scripture points otherwise. In spirit He dwells among those who believe.
I've said this many times. You can destroy every written paper of The Gospel and The Gospel will survive and be told. Not because man has kept it in existence but because it is written into our hearts. The Holy Spirit ministers what we need to know and understand to us. The Gates of Hell can not prevail against it. The new church the new foundation the Rock is GOD revealing Jesus Christ to us. The New Testament Church is one of revelation a one on one ministry from The Holy Spirit to man.
Peter was the leader of the Disciples but Paul through the revelation by The Holy Spirit wrote the basic guidance's for the churches to go by.
Why should people doubt that the establishment of other churches who worship Jesus Christ and proclaim Him as Lord and Savior are not part of GOD's plan? Differences in theological issues were there even among the chosen 12. As well a simple disagreement between Paul and Barnabas lead to their separation and doubled in effect their ministry outreach.
Which Church is The Church? The Church is the believers and followers of Jesus Christ who accept God's Covenant. It's basic, it's simple, it is so a child can learn it.
Matt ch 18 1About that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Which of us is greatest in the Kingdom of Heaven?” 2Jesus called a small child over to him and put the child among them. 3Then he said, “I assure you, unless you turn from your sins and become as little children, you will never get into the Kingdom of Heaven. 4Therefore, anyone who becomes as humble as this little child is the greatest in the Kingdom of Heaven. 5And anyone who welcomes a little child like this on my behalf is welcoming me. 6But if anyone causes one of these little ones who trusts in me to lose faith, it would be better for that person to be thrown into the sea with a large millstone tied around the neck.
I believe if GOD calls or The Holy Spirit leads a person a person to be a in a Catholic, Baptist, Methodist, Charismatic, or Pentecostal church etc which proclaim The Gospel then a person should do such. That is between them and GOD and for Him to sort out as to the whys and how comes. If GOD wants more Catholics, Baptist, or whatever it is certainly His right to call persons to that church via The Holy Spirit.
I believe the multitude of churches are merely a means or tool to spread The Gospel to all nations. I also believe that because I think this worlds time is quickly reaching it's end.
ALL Catholic believers are "born again" and have been so for 2,000 years. Where have you been and how do you get to make the rules of Christianity???? We, Catholics were here for 1,600 years and then along you came, reinterpreting scripture (with which the Catholics provided you ) and remaking the rules...great gig if you can get it!!!
“Wow, well aren’t you just the smartest boy in the class?!”
You should try to keep your insecurities out of theological discussions.
“No believer would speak like that to a fellow believer.”
Nonsense. The first two Spiritual Works of Mercy are admonishing the sinner and instructing the ignorant.
“There is the Catholic arrogance”
There is that insecurity again. One thing, at least, you’ve made clear. You don’t hate the Church because of theological differences. You hate her because you feel small and ignorant when you allow yourself to contemplate her glory as the supernatural bride of Christ.
“You just gave away what you truly are, dsc....a Catholic snob.”
The term “Catholic snob” is an oxymoron. What I am is an intellectual snob, and that snobbery is in direct opposition to Catholicism, which calls us to humility.
Though I am, lamentably, still something of an intellectual snob, I do not look down upon the stupid. I look down upon the willfully ignorant, whose ignorance allows them to think themselves wise.
“It takes absolutely no sophistication or great intellect at all to understand the simple message of the Gospel...even a little child can understand.”
A child can understand on a child’s level, but an adult can understand on an adult’s plane: a deeper, more sophisticated understanding. Some few, those in whom is combined intelligence, wisdom, scholarship, and holiness, can understand on levels utterly inaccessible to their inferiors. Saints Alphonsus Liguori, Thomas Aquinas, and Augustine leap to mind.
The rest of us can only read their works and follow them in understanding as far as is given to us.
Many Protestants—not all—make a fetish of insisting that a child’s understanding is the only understanding. They have to, really, because there would otherwise be no excuse for failing to seek, or at least to desire, a more mature understanding.
“Seems that is the kind of thing the Pharisees might have said”
Uh, yeah, you need to look more deeply into Our Lord’s criticisms of Pharisees.
“I stand by what I said before...no true believer stays in a Catholic church once born again.”
And you wag your finger at others and call them arrogant. Astounding.