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To: Sopater

First point: The headline is misleading. Nowhere does he “rebuke” these writers.

Second, much of the Bible, including much of what is attributed to “Peter”, “Paul” (a lot), and “John” (especially), is pseudonymous. It’s pseudepigraphic, written by someone else in the names of the apostles or the next generation of apostles (such as Paul) to give their writings greater credibility.

If I were to sit down tonight and write a novel and sign it “Charles Dickens”, would it be a long-undiscovered novel by Dickens (believe me, I can imitate his style pretty well) or is it pseudo-Dickens? Similarly with the works attributed to Peter, Paul, and John — not all, but many.

Further, a group of scholars who studied the Bible and the writings in the Gospel concluded that the least of what Jesus actually said and did is what is in “John”. John is not what you call the finest source material.

Now, as to Osteen’s message:

Have you never heard of “hate the sin, love the sinner”? Whatever the acts that a person chooses, that person is still a child of God who is here because God wants it that way. So when you condemn, you condemn part of God’s creation. Do you really feel like it’s your place to do that? What kind of a God creates all this just to condemn the bulk of it?

“Judge not, lest ye be judged.”

The Golden Rule (a version of which exists in every major religion) says “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.” Do you wish others to sit in condemnation of you? Do you think it would be their place to do so? Furthermore, holding that doesn’t help your state of being any. It simply allows that person to bother you even when that person is nowhere near. What’s the point of that?

Yes, of course, we strive to live a moral, ethical, godly life. And nobody makes the best choice all the time. That’s life. It certainly doesn’t put any of us in some holier-than-thou position to condemn others to eternal damnation, if there is indeed such a thing.

Isn’t the essence of God Divine Love? Divine Love transcends all conditions in this world. If God is universal and infinite, then God’s love must be universal and infinite. (Logic 101.) That means it extends to all, always.

The good news here is that in God’s love, we can always choose again. We can always decide to redirect and change our lives. And that is what any spiritual belief system calls us to do.


41 posted on 08/28/2013 2:35:26 PM PDT by TBP (Obama lies, Granny dies.)
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To: TBP
...a group of scholars who studied the Bible and the writings in the Gospel concluded that the least of what Jesus actually said and did is what is in “John”. John is not what you call the finest source material.

If you're talking about the liberal, self-proclaimed bible scholars called the "Jesus Seminar", I prefer to follow the already well established fundamental assertion that the gospels are authentic and historically accurate.
55 posted on 08/28/2013 2:59:10 PM PDT by Sopater (Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? - Matthew 20:15a)
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To: TBP
Isn’t the essence of God Divine Love? Divine Love transcends all conditions in this world. If God is universal and infinite, then God’s love must be universal and infinite. (Logic 101.) That means it extends to all, always.

That and His divine Rightousness, Justice, and Holiness. His Divine Love provided a way for us to be found rightous through the atoning death of His Son, Jesus Christ, however:
"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.' (Mat 7:21-23)


Whatever the acts that a person chooses, that person is still a child of God who is here because God wants it that way. So when you condemn, you condemn part of God’s creation. Do you really feel like it’s your place to do that? What kind of a God creates all this just to condemn the bulk of it?

Are you kidding me?
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God. (1Co 6:9-11)

59 posted on 08/28/2013 3:08:34 PM PDT by Sopater (Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? - Matthew 20:15a)
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To: TBP

“If there is such a thing as eternal damnation”. How can he doubt that?


105 posted on 09/23/2013 9:42:19 PM PDT by MamaB
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To: TBP

Every one is NOT a child of God. We are all HIs creation but only those that have accepted His gift of salvation and Jesus as their lord and savior, are His children. We are to judge those that claim to be a christain, but not those that are not saved.No person can condemn anyone to hell,any more than any person can save your soul. Even God does not condemn you to hell.You send your self there, by rejecting His Son Jesus christ.You have free will.Yes Joel needs our prayers. Because God says in His Word “that He will not be mocked”.I have a problem with the way Joel preaches, because he is misleading people,and he is not teaching the TRUTH. For his love of money, he does’nt want to “offend anyone”.It is so sad that so many people are are hell bound, because they would rather listen to this kind of teaching, rather that the TRUTH.The Bible says “that there will be no excuess”. God does love us all,and it is not His will that any should perrish, but He is also a “just” god.


109 posted on 09/24/2013 8:48:21 PM PDT by DRAB
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