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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans; unlearner
Until God quickens a man and reveals Jesus Christ to Him, He cannot believe or even understand anything to do with the Gospel.

The problem, or perhaps difference, is that Calvinists seem to be of the persuasion that man cannot choose until and unless he is born again first. But that precludes choosing, which God commands clearly in Scripture.

I think that God is more than capable of clearing the fog, as it were, and opening the heart and mind of an individual when presented with the truth, and giving that person the chance to choose before being born again. When that person chooses, responds to God, then he is born again.

God commands all men everywhere to repent and it is His will that all come to salvation. If His will is indeed irresistible, then all men would be saved since He clearly states in Scripture that that is His will.

Obviously not all men are saved. But to try to explain that away with the idea that God makes some men fit for destruction only does not fit with a God of love and mercy nor can one reconcile a God who would command men to do something He made them incapable of and still hold them responsible for it.

129 posted on 06/08/2013 7:24:40 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

“But that precludes choosing, which God commands clearly in Scripture.”


This is a false assumption. Calvinists don’t believe there is no actual believing or choosing going on. We just assert that it is God who gives it to us to believe.

Jer_24:7 And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the LORD: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto me with their whole heart.

Eze 36:26-27 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. (27) And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

“If His will is indeed irresistible, then all men would be saved since He clearly states in Scripture that that is His will.”


But the fact is that not everyone actually receives it from the Father to believe.

Joh 6:64-65 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him. (65) And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

I’ve used this example a number of times, though if you notice that constantly in Christ’s dealings with those who do not believe, His response isn’t “I revealed the truth to you and you rejected it.” He constantly asserts that they do not believe, because it is impossible for anyone to believe unless the Father gives it. The Lord does indeed offer and reason with unbelievers everyday... yet He is found among those who “did not seek me.”

Only those whom the Father has given to the Son can come to Him, and none who belong to the Son can fail to come.


132 posted on 06/08/2013 7:34:22 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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