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To: terycarl

” it is of course, impossible to prove that the teachings of the church, from the Chair of Peter, thus infallible, are indeed infallible. If you do not agree that EVERY “INFALLIBLE” teaching of the church was true, point them out and explain why they are in error.”

Let’s start with your truth claim - that the Catholic Church is infallible. It is not up to me to disprove your claims. It is up to you to demonstrate that they are reasonable claims. That a reasonable person can look at the facts, logic or evidence and conclude your claim is likely true.

Do you have any facts, evidence, logic, etc. that might buttress your claim of truth?

I know of zero to support your claim. Clearly, if you have more than just an opinion, it should be shared.

If on the other hand, your opinion is simply your personal belief, apart from facts, logic or evidence, just say so. That isn’t a very high standard, but I’m open to hearing whatever you have to offer.

Perhaps you can start with a low bar proof... is there anything the Church is infallible about that is not revealed in the Bible, or in Apostles’ tradition (provable via evidence in the first 100 years of practice)? Do you have any way to prove that this was infallible?

I believe you are in a real quandary here. Ultimately, it appears your truth claim is that you simply believe the Church is infallible - apart from any way to know if your opinion is valid. If so, fine. Many people use that standard to believe all kinds of things from Bigfoot to mormonism.

However, this will have a bearing on your earlier claims.


89 posted on 01/28/2013 4:01:19 PM PST by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
Do you have any facts, evidence, logic, etc. that might buttress your claim of truth?

if you decide, in court for example, that the defendant is not telling the truth, it is up to you to prove that he/she is not doing so. "I didn't commit the crime because I was with my girlfriend and she will testify to that...."

I will, however give some possibilities as to the truth of infallability.

Didn't Jesus say something along the line of "if you bind it on earth, it will be bound in heaven and if you loose it on earth it will be loosed in heaven?"

do you think that He would give the church the authority to DETERMINE what the truth was, and then be stuck with His promise to make it so in heaven....I don't think so. He also PROMISED to guide the church until the end of time.....close enough for me!!

116 posted on 01/29/2013 3:18:34 PM PST by terycarl
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