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To: Titanites
In your own efforts to paint these men as simply (wannabe?) pirates, and nothing else, it is apparent that the religious component, as it regarded their ill fate, is being studiously overlooked.

From a [U.S.] National Park Service link which you yourself have cited here previous;

The End of the Colony

Presumed wannabe pirate but a Catholic, or simply being a fiddle player -- then ok, but a Huguenot? Death to ye.

As I mentioned before, much of this can be seen as carry-over from the religious wars in Europe at the time.

Yes, sick, but done to those murdering pirates were occupying Spanish territory, pirating Spanish ships and plundering Spanish settlements, and who had pirated Menedez’s own ships and killed his son.

Spanish territory? Yea, and the Moon belonged to the U.S. after the astronauts planted a flag, and spent a few nights there.

Murdering pirates? Unless a Catholic, then hey, that's different...

Perhaps one could rename the so-called "Bush Doctrine" the King Phillipe of Spain doctrine? No, wait --- the Bush doctrine did not include a "kill them all" clause in regards to those of a different religion. The Spaniard's did.

The blog like you offered, Pauline's Pirates & Privateers has a slightly different version than most other accounts, in that it is claimed A mass grave was dug for these men and over it de Menendez erected a marker which read: "I do this not to Frenchmen but to heretics.

Note that he did not say "pirates".
The executioner himself declaring himself doing such not to Frenchmen (whom otherwise may be entitled to some decency?) nor to pirates, (either caught in the act or convicted at trial before execution?) but to "heretics". Other accounts say he left them not buried, but "hanging in the trees". Since this reportedly shocked both Catholic and Protestant, even during a period which had seen a great many other atrocities having been committed in religious warfare, I'll go with that it was at least believed/i> in Europe at the time, that he left them hanging in trees, declaring them heretics, and most likely did so too, for that matter.

Tell me again about truth often seems like slander to those who cannot see?

90 posted on 07/08/2012 2:51:09 PM PDT by BlueDragon (cast your bread upon the waters, it will come back to you after many days... all soggy)
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To: BlueDragon; Salvation
In your own efforts to paint these men as simply (wannabe?) pirates, and nothing else

I did no such thing. Look at how many times in my posts they've been called Huguenots. They were Huguenots and they were pirates. The only thing being portrayed in the original post is that they were Huguenots.Presumed wannabe pirates

There's no presumption about it.

Spanish territory?

Whether you want to believe it was Spanish territory or not is irrelevant. The Spanish perceived it as theirs, and they set out to protect it.

Note that he did not say "pirates".

Would it have changed anything if he had? The fact is they were. The fact is he didn't like heretics. They were both to him, and they had pirated his own ships and taken his son. I wouldn't doubt he had some hatred against them.

Tell me again about truth often seems like slander to those who cannot see?

I haven't denied the religious component, and have in fact linked to discussion about it as you have shown. I don't deny it. However, that was not the only factor. I was not the one portraying these people as just Huguenots simply seeking to practice their religion. They were pirates plundering Spanish settlements and ships. Bad things happen to criminals. These were thieves and bad things happened to them. My argument is with portraying them as simply religious people minding their own business.

I'll go with that

I wouldn't suspect you'd do anything less. If you want to proceed with portraying these people as just peaceful Huguenots minding their own business, you have the right to do so. It would be a denial of the truth, but don't let that interfere. I can understand why some might be upset that Ribault was not the one who was successful in his initial attack, but that's history.

91 posted on 07/08/2012 3:51:06 PM PDT by Titanites
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To: BlueDragon
"As I mentioned before, much of this can be seen as carry-over from the religious wars in Europe at the time.

You cannot ignore the alliance between Islam and Protestantism and how that would have been viewed by King Philip II. Spain had been in a 700 year war with Islam and was still fighting Islam throughout the Mediterranean and the Asian trade routes. The prospect of allies of Islam operating openly freely near its major trade routes was not acceptable.

On a personal level Philip II was the son of Emperor Charles V of the Holy Roman Empire. The Holy Roman Empire was then fighting both Ottoman expansion into Europe and active wars with Protestants across the continent.

Lastly, in the New World, the Spanish had encountered the most Satanic elements ever witnessed by Christendom in the Aztec empire. To a people who believed that the only difference between humans and animals was a soul those whom they believed had willingly forfeited their souls by rejecting Catholicism were no better than animals. Their treatment by the Spanish military reflected this.

This behavior was not exclusive to the Spanish or Catholics. While French Huguenots were being killed by Spain, Irish Catholic men, women and children were being killed in much larger numbers as an intentional strategy because of their religion for residing in a town that refused to surrender. Where Menéndez spared the women and children and sent them by ship to Havana, no such mercy was shown by Cromwell.

Peace be with you

92 posted on 07/08/2012 3:56:47 PM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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