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To: stpio

I have deliberately used Luther’s preferred analogy when likening it to a fire. (I’m not a Lutheran.)

But a fire is a unitary phenomenon. That’s what I’m getting at. If you have a fire, it consumes fuel and air, and it brings forth heat and light. Likewise the faith-works duality is a united phenomenon. What evangelicals protest is a sort of false “churchianity” which makes dry assertions then tries in a humanly power to show how good it is. This was a bigger problem with Roman congregations in Luther’s day than it is now.


425 posted on 07/16/2012 11:07:06 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (let me ABOs run loose, lew (or is that lou?))
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To: HiTech RedNeck

“I have deliberately used Luther’s preferred analogy when likening it to a fire. (I’m not a Lutheran.)

But a fire is a unitary phenomenon. That’s what I’m getting at. If you have a fire, it consumes fuel and air, and it brings forth heat and light. Likewise the faith-works duality is a united phenomenon. What evangelicals protest is a sort of false “churchianity” which makes dry assertions then tries in a humanly power to show how good it is. This was a bigger problem with Roman congregations in Luther’s day than it is now.”

~ ~ ~

Why do you use any example of Martin Luther? The man has
a horrid history, he was not a holy man.

I don’t know if it’s the right word “duality” but if you mean the two are required for Salvation, yes, it’s both faith and works. I agree, as Paul says in Ephesians 2:8-10, not by our own works which is a false show of being good, rather, it’s deciding to do a work, a genuine work, a good with God’s help, His grace.

Evangelicals and most Protestants protest more than a fake show of works, you all profess works are not required for
Salvation.

You mentioned false acts of goodness in Luther’s time because the true faith existed then, there wasn’t Protestantism yet, it was just beginning. You have your own, one example, the “Toronto blessing”. About “false Churchanity.” Non-Catholics accept some rituals in the Old Testament, God desires certain rituals, the most pleasing to Him, the holy Sacrifice of the Mass.


439 posted on 07/17/2012 12:58:14 PM PDT by stpio
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