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To: metmom; Jvette
The body has to be intrinsically different to be glorified like Jesus' body was, one that could appear and disappear in and out of our space/time continuum, one which could pass through walls and closed doors.

I agree.

It makes not one iota of difference if it looks the same. It CAN'T be the same, not intrinsically.

Again, TRUE. The point is lost upon me as to why it is important that the very same physical substance (atom-by-atom reconstruction) must be used, as our FRiend seems to require - Whether that or not, the change necessary to 'appear and disappear in and out of our space/time continuum, [and] pass through walls and closed doors' seems significant enough to easily justify the term 'new'. The form-factor is certainly different, regardless of the parts list, and where or how the parts are obtained.

It does not matter one whit to me what it is made of, or how it might be accomplished - All of that is far beyond my ken. I will be content to be utterly amazed at the time.

My point is that the argument is basically centered around the definition of the word 'new' and what that means (brandy spankin' or remodeled)... and is really a thing without any distinction. Whether new or remodeled, any remodeling must needfully be great enough to be considered as 'new' anyway:

I recently bought a new place, which I got a screaming deal on, because it was so decrepit. By the time I got done remodeling, the only things that were saved were the basic structure (the framing, which also got major repairs), the foundation, and the roofing... All new plumbing, all new electric, new siding, sheet-rock, floors, flooring, paint, int & ext trim, appliances, and etc. ad-infinitum...

One could argue that it is the same old house. But one could also argue that it is new, as what was old in it is so largely replaced and reconfigured as to make any mention of the 'old' pretty irrelevant. But which ever way you'd like to look at it, the house is still the same - the look and layout have not changed.

And had I torn it down and rebuilt it wholly new, very little would be any different from what it is now

That is the point - I think the scope of remodeling makes any argument over whether new or remodeled pretty much an irrelevant thing.

328 posted on 06/18/2012 11:49:33 AM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)
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To: editor-surveyor; Iscool
Whoops. ping
329 posted on 06/18/2012 11:51:59 AM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)
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To: roamer_1
I recently bought a new place, which I got a screaming deal on, because it was so decrepit. By the time I got done remodeling, the only things that were saved were the basic structure (the framing, which also got major repairs), the foundation, and the roofing... All new plumbing, all new electric, new siding, sheet-rock, floors, flooring, paint, int & ext trim, appliances, and etc. ad-infinitum...

Good illustration.

It reminds me of something I ran across some years ago. Romans 12:2 admonishes us to that kind of renewal of our minds, the term *renew* carries with it the idea of renovation. IOW, renovate your mind. It's still basically the same mind, just like the house has the same basic structure, but new in basically every other respect.

The simple fact that this sin corrupted body cannot physically survive outside some very narrow parameters, it simply cannot be the same TYPE of body, even if it looks the same.

Plus when the heavens and earth melt away with a fervent heat, we'd sunk if we had these bodies.

330 posted on 06/18/2012 12:27:27 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: roamer_1; metmom; Jvette
I already have a picture of me in my “prime”. I was about late twenties or early thirties, in GREAT shape, etc. and, if we can at all possibly choose what we WILL look like for eternity, I'd be happy with this “me”. ;o)

I would think little babies that died wouldn't STILL be infants in their glorified bodies, would they? We can be pretty confident that those who were born disfigured or missing limbs will have bodies that are whole in heaven. Disintegrated, nothing but dust, bodies WILL be changed and be reconstituted AS something we cannot imagine, but WILL recognize. I wonder how Peter knew it was Moses and Elijah standing there with Jesus? They didn't have a Polaroid. Nobody will be “ugly” or “homely” there, I don't believe. So it is only logical that, whatever this glorified body is, it WILL be new, different, changed and built for eternity. Eye has not seen, nor ear heard nor entered into the heart of man what wonderful things God has prepared for those that love Him.

335 posted on 06/18/2012 10:58:55 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: roamer_1

By the time I got done remodeling, the only things that were saved were the basic structure (the framing, which also got major repairs), the foundation, and the roofing...

One could argue that it is the same old house.

There is no argument, it is the same house. You did not tear down and haul away the basics. You did not dig up the foundation and pour a new one. You began with what you had and improved it.

It really is a perfect metaphor for our bodies, which are new and fresh and good and through age and abuse and sinfulness becomes decrepit until it passes away. But then the Lord comes and raises it up and restores all that newness and adds glory to it. But, it is still the same body with which we began.


343 posted on 06/19/2012 10:01:51 AM PDT by Jvette
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