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To: alancarp
So, what did the first apostles teach from? There was no New Testament Bible when Jesus died. They taught what they had learned from Christ, Christ's Traditions. The Bible as we know it today wasn't formalized until 400 AD. What did they use?

Where in the Bible does it say "scripture only?"

Do you believe in the Trinity? It doesn't say Trinity any where in the bible, so how can you believe in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit?

Martin Luther wanted everyone to interpretate scripture for themselves. How does 25,000 different Christian denominations rationalize Christian unity?

There can only be one truth, which one is right? Let me guess, yours.

You can believe what ever you want, but make no mistake, the Catholic Church is the trunk and all other Christian denominations are branches. I'll stay with the trunk.
58 posted on 04/16/2012 8:30:17 AM PDT by JPII Be Not Afraid
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To: JPII Be Not Afraid
So, what did the first apostles teach from? See my post 59. It was about scripture, not traditions.

Where in the Bible does it say "scripture only?" It doesn't, and I have not said that. However, I have cited 2 Tim. 3:16-17 on the authority of scripture coming from God. You can't cite such a thing for extra-Biblical traditions.

Trinity. Yes, I do: that's a man-conceived phrase for a plain teaching in scripture - that there are 3 persons in the God-head. I don't think I have to cite the basis of that for you. But is this an 'extra-Biblical' tradition (pre-empting the next question)? I say no, because I can literally cite chapter and verse the basis of this doctrine.

Christian Unity. We Protestants indeed fail here ... every denomination created after the Reformation has been created on the basis of either error, style, emphasis or some combination of all three. Most Many of us have certain 'essentials' that we agree upon. Of course, if this is our only problem (unfortunately not), then that's pretty good. Clearly, God wants us all to get it right... which leads into...

Truth. Well, there's the rub, right? Yeah.... we need to find the truth. I'm hardly perfect, so no, I don't claim to know it all. I'd like to think I recognize obvious error when I see it, and my complaint with the RCC is that a sizable chunk of your doctrine is not backed up by scripture. Maybe you don't understand it from an outsider's point of view, but saying "well, we do it this way because we always have believe it to be right" doesn't have the same strength as "we do it this way because it's commanded by scripture that I can show you right here." That's the essence of my complaint.

The trunk. You are correct - the RCC is the trunk of the church. I recognize that's a hard thing to question or to give up...Especially when you see a myriad of competing options out there. My goal here is not to get anyone to join my church. It's to recognize (maybe) that scripture has much more weight in matters of doctrine than anything else.

63 posted on 04/16/2012 9:06:18 AM PDT by alancarp (Liberals are all for shared pain... until they're included in the pain group.)
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To: JPII Be Not Afraid
So, what did the first apostles teach from?

Isn't it obvious that the apostles taught from the OT? How many times do they quote the OT in the New? The Septuigent and the Hebrew scriptures were both available.

They taught what they had learned from Christ

Which was the OT! Luke 24:27 - "Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets, He explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures."

The Bible as we know it today wasn't formalized until 400 AD. What did they use?

The canon was established well before 400 AD. What did the apostles quote from? The entire NT was written before 100 AD. How could they quote from the OT if it didn't exist until 400? What did Jesus quote from? What did He read in the temple? The Jerusalem Times?

74 posted on 04/16/2012 11:19:54 AM PDT by dartuser ("If you are ... what you were ... then you're not.")
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