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To: smvoice; metmom; caww
I was reading this article recently about this point. Let me know what you think. The site is http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Psychology/char/35.htm#anchor1240880

There are three approaches that can be followed to determine WHEN tongues did in fact cease. We shall now consider each of these approaches.

I. THE HISTORICAL APPROACH

There is overwhelming historical evidence that the gift of tongues ceased early in the history of the church. Richard Quebedeaux, a friend of the Charismatic movement, admits this very fact:

"Evidence for the appearance of glossolalia, at least from the late second century to the eighteenth or nineteenth century, is scarce and frequently obscure. ... Origen, in the third century, and Chrysostom, in the fourth, both disparaged the accounts of speaking in tongues, and rejected its continued validity. Augustine, early in the fifth century, asserted that glossolalia was a sign adapted only to biblical times" (Richard Quebedeaux, The New Charismatics, pp. 20-21).

The comment by the preacher Chrysostom is worthy of note: "This whole place is very obscure [commenting on the references to tongues in 1 Corinthians] but the obscurity is produced by our ignorance of the facts referred to and by their cessation, being such as then used to occur, but now no longer take place" (Homilies, XXIX, 1). In other words, Chrysostom writing in the 4th century recognized that the gift of tongues described by Paul was something that used to occur in Paul's day but which no longer took place in Chrysostom's day. He refers to the "cessation" of this gift.

Cleon Rogers wrote the following: "It is significant that the gift of tongues is nowhere alluded to, hinted at or even found in any writings of the Post Apostolic Fathers" (The Charismatics, p. 169). It is significant to note that the gift of tongues is mentioned in 1 Corinthians, one of Paul's earliest epistles, but it is not mentioned in any of Paul's later epistles. This suggests that the gift of tongues may have ceased even before the canon of Scripture was closed!

II. THE CONTEXTUAL APPROACH

This approach seeks to determine when tongues ceased by examining the context of 1 Corinthians 13:8 ("tongues ... shall cease"). The main message of this chapter can be summarized as follows:

1) There are three things that will fail (verse 8).
2) There are three things that will remain (verse 13).
3) There is one thing that will never fail (verse 8); it will remain forever (verse 13).

This indicates three time periods:

1) The time when the gifts of prophecy, tongues and knowledge are in force. These are special revelatory gifts given by God in the days of the early church.

2) The time when the gifts of prophecy, tongues and knowledge have failed, ceased and vanished away (verse 8) and the virtues of faith, hope and love remain (verse 13). This is the present age.

3) The time when only love remains but faith and hope do not remain. Faith is replaced by sight (2 Cor. 5:7; Heb. 11:1) and hope is replaced by realization (Rom. 8:24-25). This is the eternal state.

Thus, the passage clearly teaches that there must be a period of time prior to the eternal state when the gifts of tongues and prophecy are no longer in effect and when the virtues of faith and hope are still in effect. This contradicts the teaching of those who insist that the gift of tongues has been given by God throughout this present age.

III. THE PURPOSIVE APPROACH

What was the purpose of the gift of tongues? If the purpose for tongues is known, then it is possible to determine when tongues ceased. The purposive argument may be thus stated: Tongues ceased when they no longer served the purpose for which they were given.

There is only one place in the New Testament where Paul tells us the purpose of the gift of tongues: "Wherefore, tongues are FOR a sign ... ..." (1 Corinthians 14:22). The preposition translated "for" (eis) denotes purpose. Paul's explanation in verse 22 concerning the purpose of tongues is actually an inference based upon his words in verse 21. Verse 21 begins with these important words, "In the law it is written ..."

In verse 21 Paul cited an Old Testament passage, Isaiah 28:11-12. Paul knew that the key to understanding the Biblical purpose of tongues is found "in the law," that is, in the Old Testament Scriptures. What does the Old Testament teach concerning tongues? What was the significance and purpose of tongues in Old Testament times? When foreign tongues were spoken, what did this mean?

Isaiah 28 is not the only passage in the Old Testament which deals with the significance of foreign tongues. Several such passages together set forth a very sobering Biblical principle -- a principle which has been demonstrated repeatedly in history. As we consider foreign tongues in the Old Testament, a very sobering and sad pattern becomes evident:

GENESIS 11
God has a message for the people (Genesis 9:1,7). The people refuse to listen to God (Genesis 11:4). God causes tongues to be heard as a sign of judgment (Genesis 11:7).

Dispersion follows (Genesis 11:8).

DEUTERONOMY 28
God has a message for His people (Deut. 28:1). The people refuse to listen to God (Deut. 28:15). God causes tongues to be heard as a sign of judgment (Deut. 28:49).

Dispersion follows (Deut. 28:64-65).

JEREMIAH 5
God has a message for His people (Jer. 4:1). The people refuse to listen to God (Jer. 5:3). God causes tongues to be heard as a sign of judgment (Jer. 5:15).

Dispersion follows (Jer. 5:19).

ISAIAH 28
God has a message for His people (Isaiah 28:12a). The people refuse to listen to God (Isaiah 28:12b). God causes tongues to be heard as a sign of judgment (Isaiah 28:11).

Dispersion follows (Isaiah 28:13).

COMPARE THE OPPOSITE TAUGHT IN ISAIAH 33

The context is the millennium. God causes tongues to not be heard indicating that Israel would enjoy the blessing of God (verse 19). There would be no more dispersion!

THE PATTERN REPEATED IN THE NEW TESTAMENT

God has a message for the people (Matt. 11:28; compare Jer. 4:1; Isa. 28:12).
The people refuse to listen to God (Matt. 23:37).
God causes tongues to be heard as a sign of judgment (Acts 2,10,19, etc.).

Dispersion follows (Matt. 23:38; 24:2).

The gift of tongues served as a sign of judgment for unbelieving Israel. The sign of judgment is no longer needed after the judgment has come. In A.D. 70, the Romans under General Titus brought the Christ-rejecting nation Israel to its final ruin. Ever since A.D. 70, there has been no question that Israel as a nation is under the judgment of God. Therefore, it must be concluded that tongues as a sign gift were no longer needed after 70 AD. The last historical mention of the gift of tongues is found in 1 Corinthians, which was written about 55 AD. There is no evidence historically that the genuine gift of tongues ever occurred after 70 AD. Tongues served their purpose, and tongues ceased, even as God predicted through the Apostle Paul (1 Corinthians 13:8).

710 posted on 02/29/2012 7:28:25 PM PST by boatbums (Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us. Titus 3:5)
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To: boatbums; smvoice; Quix; caww; CynicalBear

That’s particularly interesting that tongues was not recognized and that it was acknowledged to have not been practiced by the very early church fathers; that there’s actually record of it having ceased.

You know, if Paul had written to any other church about tongues than the Corinthians church, it may have been a whole different matter, but the Corinthian church was one really messed up church. I’m not sure of the wisdom of following their example in anything.


713 posted on 02/29/2012 7:41:50 PM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: boatbums
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723 posted on 02/29/2012 8:58:21 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: boatbums; metmom; caww; CynicalBear; grey_whiskers
I know you guys are probably TIRED of me repeating this, BUT...the Book Acts IS the key to understanding tongues, healERS, signs, wonders and miracles. And actually all three approaches bear this out, in different ways, but the end result is the same: when God blinded Israel and set her aside, Acts 28, tongues, etc. were set aside also. Why? Because the signs were for Israel, for CONFIRMATION. Everywhere, and in every Book that Paul wrote BEFORE GOD SET ISRAEL ASIDE, those signs were operational. That's why you will find them in Galatians, Corinthians, and Romans. 1 and 2 Thess. were also written before Israel was set aside. After Israel's fall, Acts 28, there are NO mention of signs by Paul in ANY of his other writings. Those would be Ephesians, Colossians, Philippians, Philemon, 1 and 2 Timothy, and Titus. Proof would be Paul telling TImothy to take wine for his often stomach infirmities. Also see 2 Tim. 4:20, Phil. 2:25-29. Paul not only no longer performed things for the Jews with signs, he also no longer performed Jewish LEGAL CEREMONIES. (Phil. 3:8-14).. Why would he perform any of those things? Israel was no longer "operational", so none of their ceremonies or signs would be "operational".

Once they were set aside, the Gospel of the grace of God is preached to the nations without racial priorities (Eph. 2:11-22; 3:6), without miracles, signs, and wonders (I've already listed Scriptures above) and without legal ceremonies (noted above).

BUT NOW, the believer, as soon as he accepts the Gospel of the Grace of God, by faith, is IMMEDIATELY Spirit-baptized into the invisible and universal body of Christ by the Holy Spirit, and the believer is blessed with all spiritual blessing in heavenly places. (Eph. 1:3).

So what about the middle part of Acts, from Acts 10 until Israel is set aside? Paul had a commission of CONFIRMATION. He preached to the Jews concerning Jesus, the promised Messiah (Acts 13:14-41; 18:5; 26:22, 28:23). THIS is why Paul went to the Jew FIRST (Romans 1:16 with Acts 13:5,14,46). And THIS is why signs, wonders and miracles accompanied Paul's ministry. "Because of the Jews" (Acts 16:3). That does NOT mean that Gentiles that were saved were not privy to those same signs during this time (Corinthians proves this), but BECAUSE God had not set Israel aside yet, "because of the Jews" signs were present in the church.

Secondly, Paul had a ministry of REVELATION. Paul preached the unsearchable riches of Christ (Eph. 3:8. "unsearchable meaning unprophesied, they could not be found in Scripture, they were a MYSTERY, hid in God, until revealed to Paul). The ministry of reconciliation by grace alone (Eph. 2:8-9). This means that Paul preached the fellowship of the mystery. (Eph. 3:9). And the rest is the "But Now" history of the Church the Body of Christ, right up to this point and ultimately to the point that Christ returns for the Church the Body of Christ and we are raptured.

And that's what Acts is about. The RISE of Israel, Acts 1-3, the continued rejection of Christ as her Messiah, the raising up of Paul to CONFIRM PROPHECY concerning Israel and REVEAL REVELATIONS OF THE MYSTERY from Christ to believers who would form a NEW creation, a NEW MAN, the Church the Body of Christ, and the FALL of Israel. There is now neither Jew nor Greek in the Body. If there is no Jew, there are no signs, since signs were for them, for confirmation. It really is that simple. God Bless! smvoice

735 posted on 03/01/2012 7:48:35 AM PST by smvoice (Better Buck up, Buttercup. The wailing and gnashing are for an eternity..)
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