[presently no screen name]

Yes, I understand,
Do You? You are the one that doesn’t believe, I DO!

[boatbums]

Yes, I understand, Do You? You are the one that doesn’t believe, I DO!

I am the "one" that doesn't believe what, exactly? Jesus said quite clearly in that passage in John 9, that the man blind from birth was NOT because of his sin or those of his parents, but so that God would be glorified. This incident happened after the altercation Jesus had with the religious leaders where they tried to stone him for saying he was equal to God by forgiving sins. The blind beggar could NOT see Jesus, but Jesus saw him and when his disciples asked Jesus why the man was born blind, he very clearly said so that God would be glorified and his power made manifest. When the beggar was blind no more, he went about telling everyone of the miracle and that Jesus was the promised Messiah.

The point was that sickness is not always because of particular sins but that God is over all and when he allows sickness, he has a purpose. Sometimes that purpose is to not take it away, to not heal it, and that seems to be what "faith-healers" and those that promote their works often miss. As to whether or not there are specific people who have the first-century "gift" of healing, I say look at what they do, how they do it, who they use to demonstrate this supposed power, who gets the glory, and how they deal with people who do not respond to their actions. In most cases, the sick person is blamed for the failure of the faith healer. If people were honest about it, they would understand that God no longer uses men with this power, that his Word is the standard by which to measure the source of the power and that it is God, alone, who heals or does not heal - all for HIS glory.

Many people who are within the upper echelons of this movement are characterized by things that SHOULD give a spiritually mature Christian pause. From the site http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/wimber/general.htm, we learn:

"One of the most serious (and blasphemous) aspects of teachers like Wimber is that they are ready and willing to diminish the Lord Jesus Christ in their desperation to find some shred of biblical support for what they do ... he [Wimber] claims the ministry of Christ as a pattern for his own work. In the most explicit way he denies our Lord's divine character, detracting from His power and glory and reducing Him virtually to the level of an ordinary person. According to Wimber, Christ did not possess the personal power to read thoughts or to know the outcome of events." Wimber's motive in downgrading the person and work of Christ appeared to be "that he wants to make Christ our example not only for healing, but also for receiving 'words of knowledge' -- direct impressions and commands from God ... Wimber empties the Lord Jesus Christ of His divine attributes -- particularly His foreknowledge -- making Him totally dependent upon the Father for both information and orders concerning His activities moment by moment ... Wimber repeatedly emphasizes this 'limited' divinity of Jesus as he strives to make Him a person who we can legitimately imitate in every respect, including the receiving of intuitions from God, and the performing of healing works" (Masters, pp. 46-47 -- see Col. 1:15,19; 2:3,9; Heb. 1:3; Jn. 1:14; 6:64; 16:30 for Biblical refutation of Wimber's theology). Wimber's teaching was "anti-Christian in his abuse of Christ, despising and disregarding His divinity and glory in order to present Him as a 'humanized' example of healing techniques which may be copied in our day" (Masters, p. 51).

Wimber's doctrine of Demonology was thoroughly unscriptural; he saw demons behind many physical illnesses, and most emotional problems, entering into people, both lost and saved, in varying degrees, either for "possession" or "oppression," so as to control all or some aspects of their lives. "There is no biblical basis for the notion that demons are free to cause illnesses outside the context of full demon possession. [And the power of Satan to enter and "possess" souls uninvited; i.e., at the whim of the demon, was ended at Christ's resurrection.] The only case in the Bible of a person who suffered from an illness caused by Satan without being demon possessed, is that of Job" (Masters, p. 86).

But even then, Satan had to secure permission from God, which would indicate that Satan and his demons have no power to inflict illnesses in the ordinary course of events. To treat illnesses on the basis of a demon needing to be expelled from a particular organ, as Wimber taught, is an idea derived from pagan religious cults and/or the priestcraft of Rome, not from the Bible. Believers will certainly do battle with the wiles and temptations wrought by Satan, "but nowhere in the New Testament is temptation resisted by a process of commanding demons to loose their hold or leave a Christian's mind or body. Satan is resisted by being denied success in the temptation. Or if he mounts an attack of depressive suggestions, he is resisted as the believer strives to keep hold of the comfort and promises of God's Word" (Masters, p. 92).

Professor Verna Wright, M.D., Rheumatology, concluded that the great dangers of Wimber's "miraculous healing teaching" are: (1) "it discredits the person of Christ because of the very obvious failures, when we claim to serve a Savior Who never fails"; (2) "it undermines the Word, because it elevates a new form of 'revelation' -- so-called words of knowledge or prophecy"; (3) "it deceives Christians and breeds a race of gullible believers, taken in by virtually anything"; (4) "it increases the agony of suffering"; (5) "it removes Christian comfort"; and (6) "it diminishes Christian testimony." (Cited in Masters, p. 227)

Wimber always placed himself and his ministry above criticism; "... he equates those who measure a practice or ministry by Scripture with the unbelieving scribes. This effectively insulates his teaching and practice from Scriptural critique. He is equating his ministry with non-recognition of the person and ministry of the Holy Spirit ... Wimber is hiding behind a facade of true adherence to the moving of the Spirit of God in order to insulate his theology and practices from those who would unravel the facade with God's Word. At the same time, he equates anyone that would challenge that facade with those who did not recognize Jesus' authority and work. This is a cult mentality that does not address the real issue: whether or not these practices and ideas are biblical" (MS, p. 23-24).

So, you say you understand the point of John 9 and question my understanding AND my belief. Perhaps, it is NOT me that is lacking in faith. Those who MUST have experience to convince them of God's working set themselves up for deception and ultimately, control by forces NOT from God.