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To: Jvette
>>And it is just coincidence that the very next thing He says, in the same sentence, is “and upon this rock, I will build my church.”<<

No it wasn’t a coincidence. Throughout scripture it is established that God is the only Rock. Peter has just confirmed that he believes Jesus is that Rock and Christ then says “upon this Rock I will build my church”. It’s the same Rock that God says "Is there any God besides Me, or is there any other Rock? I know of none." Once verse does not change what has been established throughout the rest of scripture.

>>Peter leads the Church on earth after Christ’s ascension<<

Only in the minds of Catholics. Even James was more the leader in Jerusalem. Paul wrote to the Romans and didn’t even mention Peter. There is no proof that Peter was even over the church in Rome nor that he was leader in any capacity other than to the Jews.

>>There were some Jews who rejected Christ and some that did not.<<

Romans 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. 12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness? 13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles

Through their fall is talking about the Jews. Paul is the apostle to the Gentiles, the church, not Peter as the RCC would like to portray.

1,051 posted on 01/13/2012 6:43:07 PM PST by CynicalBear
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To: CynicalBear

***No it wasn’t a coincidence.

Peter has just confirmed that he believes Jesus is that Rock***

So, it was Peter who called Jesus the Rock and not the other way around? Hmmmm. Here I was thinking that Peter had just confirmed that Jesus is the Son of the Living God and that Jesus then called Peter, rock.

***Only in the minds of Catholics. Even James was more the leader in Jerusalem. Paul wrote to the Romans and didn’t even mention Peter. There is no proof that Peter was even over the church in Rome nor that he was leader in any capacity other than to the Jews.****

All of this has been thoroughly gone over and shown to be in complete contrast with what Scripture actually says and what history has recorded.

But, I thoroughly understand why one must cling to these beliefs.

***Through their fall is talking about the Jews. Paul is the apostle to the Gentiles, the church, not Peter as the RCC would like to portray.***

So, as I thought, in the mind of one who thinks as you do, there were no Jews in the Church.

Hmmm. What does St. Paul say in Ephesians?

Brothers and sisters:
You have heard of the stewardship of God’s grace
that was given to me for your benefit,
namely, that the mystery was made known to me by revelation.
It was not made known to people in other generations
as it has now been revealed
to his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit:
that the Gentiles are coheirs, members of the same body,
and copartners in the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel.

With whom are the Gentiles now coheirs, members of the same body and copartners with?


1,068 posted on 01/13/2012 7:13:23 PM PST by Jvette
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To: CynicalBear; Jvette
Jvette, perhaps you aren't aware that Peter and the 11 confined their ministry in Palestine only until the setting aside of Israel, in Acts 28.

"And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree." Acts 10:39.

"And when we (Paul's missionary journey) were come to Jerusalem, the BRETHREN received us gladly. Peter and the 11 were still at Jerusalem. Acts 21:17-20.

Where Peter and the 11 may have gone AFTER Acts 28, when Israel was fully set aside, isn't of importance in this conversation. The fact is Peter and the 11 remained in Jerusalem, preaching the Kingdom Gospel to Israel, in hopes that she would accept Christ as her Messiah, and He would return to set up His Kingdom. Remember, Christ told them to go to all nations preaching the gospel, BEGINNING AT JERUSALEM. Until Israel was saved and brought to Messiah's feet, they remained there. Which we know never happened. She, as a Nation, rejected Him until they were finally set aside. Before Paul is saved in Acts 9 and sent to the Gentiles with the gospel of the uncircumcision and the grace of God, the ONE Gentile family to which Peter ministered to dwelt at Caesarea, in Palestine. (Acts 10:24). And that was through a vision, a trance, where Jesus Christ gave him specific instructions to go to Cornelius. This was done so that when Paul came to the 12 (Gal. 2:11-14) the twelve would understand that Paul was indeed sent to the gentiles. Notice in Gal. that the 12 agree to confine their ministry to the circumcision; the Jews.

The church that Peter and the 11 were ministering to in Jerusalem was the Messianic Church, made up of the little flock and those who believed at Pentecost. Notice they were ALL JEWS. Waiting for the Kingdom to be established. And waiting for Christ's return to set up His kingdom

1,069 posted on 01/13/2012 7:13:53 PM PST by smvoice (Better Buck up, Buttercup. The wailing and gnashing is for an eternity..)
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