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To: D-fendr

There was no OFFICIAL teaching of transubstantiation until that nasty old Fourth Lateran Council (1215)

There was no official doctrine of that until that council ...looking at the church fathers one sees differing opinions on the Lords table..some in agreement with the Roman church and some with the reformers..

The Didache calls the bread and wine food and nothing more...

One more time..The NT church had no priests, no mass, no altar, ...the NT church looked more like my church than yours


872 posted on 11/28/2011 1:59:52 PM PST by RnMomof7
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To: RnMomof7
"There was no OFFICIAL teaching of transubstantiation until that nasty old Fourth Lateran Council (1215)"

Teresa, do you really believe that posting a lie will make it somehow true or will alter the actual truth? The Fourth Lateran Council accepted the term "transubstantiation", but it has been around since Jesus said "This is my body".

876 posted on 11/28/2011 2:12:52 PM PST by Natural Law (If you love the Catholic Church raise your hands, if not raise your standards.)
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To: RnMomof7

You seem to like St. Justin Martyrs treatise. Except for the Eucharist part.

Transubstantiation is one means of explaining the Real Presence correctly in Aristotelean terms. It’s not the only way, nor even necessary. Someone could develop another syllogism or argument concerning it tomorrow and it would not affect the faith. What is important is the correct belief in the Real Presence in the Holy Eucharist.

As C.S. Lewis put it: Christ said: “Take, eat.” not “Take, understand.”

So when or how transubstantiation is taught is irrelevant so long as the fundamental belief is there. As St. Justin put it:

“For not as common bread and common drink do we receive these; but in like manner as Jesus Christ our Saviour, having been made flesh by the Word of God, had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so likewise have we been taught that the food which is blessed by the prayer of His word, and from which our blood and flesh by transmutation are nourished, is the flesh and blood of that Jesus who was made flesh.”

As the Church has always taught and believed and as you saw through St. Justin Martyr’s eyes.


881 posted on 11/28/2011 2:23:51 PM PST by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: RnMomof7; D-fendr; metmom; CynicalBear; rzman21; Natural Law

the offical teaching of transubstantiation came in 33ad from the Lord Himself.

Christians have believed Him for 2,000 years from Paul to Ignatius to Justin Martyr to Irenaeus to Cyprian to Jerome to Augustine to Thomas to today.

this teaching is folly to the non-Christian.


930 posted on 11/28/2011 4:49:51 PM PST by one Lord one faith one baptism
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