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To: D-fendr
"You don’t see that Jesus instructions about who to pray to is pertinent to this conversation?"

This is like listening to an ultra-Orthodox Jew lecture on the necessity of Glatt Kosher. The necessity to maintain two completely different sets of plates and cooking utensils is not because God instructed it, it is because God forbade participating in the feast of Baal in which a calf was cooked in its mothers milk. The Ultra Orthodox have extended this from a calf and its mothers milk to a calf and any dairy, to any meat with any dairy to a requirement that there must never be an opportunity for the two to have ever come into contact anywhere food is prepared for them.

In Matthew 6 Jesus did not say that the ONLY way to pray was to recite the Our Father (which Protestants have added to, by the way), or only to God the Father. He gave an example that is culturally rich. By using the word Abba, He said we all have an intimate and personal relationship with God, something that had previously been restricted to the nation of Israel and to the elite and the temple priests. The petitions He gave as examples followed an adulation and addressed the two greatest commandments. He then followed it by extolling us live our prayer, not just speak it.

Nowhere is it stated or even implied that we are not to pray to Jesus or the Holy Spirit or to petition saints and each other. Nowhere does it say we should not make prayers of thanksgiving or expiation.

619 posted on 11/02/2011 12:03:09 PM PDT by Natural Law (Transubstantiation - Change we can believe in.)
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To: Natural Law; D-fendr; smvoice; metmom; boatbums; caww; daniel1212
>>He said we all have an intimate and personal relationship with God<<

Say what? Catholics believe a personal relationship? Say it ain’t so. We have been told over and over that Catholics don’t believe in a personal relationship. What happened?

631 posted on 11/02/2011 12:42:50 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: Natural Law

Good analogy.

St. Paul is in big trouble under the “One Prayer Only” rule, dozens of times in his letters. And his words to “pray constantly” if it follows this rule would then invoke the “Vain and Repetitious” clause, yikes!

Then there’s Jesus in Mark 11:24 and Matt. 5:44-45…


632 posted on 11/02/2011 12:45:27 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: Natural Law
Nowhere is it stated or even implied that we are not to pray to Jesus

"If you shall ask me any thing in my name, that I will do." John 14:14

648 posted on 11/02/2011 2:00:01 PM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies
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