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To: FatherofFive
Fortunately, we have Christ’s promise that heresies will never prevail

Unfortunately, the church doctrine you speak of does not hold fast to or teach the truth; therefore Messiah's promises are not in their doctrine.

Matthew 19:17 So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.”

Messiah promised eternal life for those who keep the commandments. What is so hard to understand about that?

Prov 30:5 Every word of God is pure;
He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him.
6 Do not add to His words,
Lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.

1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked. 7 Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning.

Did you intentionally ignore YHVH’s definition of what truth is or do you enjoy obfuscating? While you ponder that, let's take a deeper look into Mt 16:18. One can not define a verse in Scripture unless one knows the meaning to critical words in the passage.

Mt 16:15 “But you,” he said to them, “who do you say I am?” 16 Shim`on Kefa(Peter) answered, “You are the Mashiach, the Son of the living God.” 17 “Shim`on Bar-Yochanan(son of Yochanan),” Yeshua said to him, “how blessed you are! For no human being revealed this to you, no, it was my Father in heaven. 18 I also tell you this: you are Kefa(Peter),” [which means `Rock,’] “and on this rock I will build my Community, and the gates of Sh’ol will not overcome it.

What? The Father revealed the truth to Peter? I guess now we need to define “Rock” using the ONLY bible dictionary they had in the 1st century. What is this rock that the community of YHVH is built on?

Deut 32:1 “Hear, oh heavens, as I speak! Listen, earth, to the words from my mouth! 2 May my teaching fall like rain. May my speech condense like dew, like light rain on blades of grass, or showers on growing plants. 3 “For I will proclaim the name of ADONAI. Come, declare the greatness of our God! 4 The Rock! His work is perfect, for all his ways are just. A trustworthy God who does no wrong, he is righteous and straight. 5 “He is not corrupt; the defect is in his children, a crooked and perverted generation...
31 For their rock is not like our Rock

2 Samuel 22:47 “The LORD lives! Blessed be my Rock! Let God be exalted, The Rock of my salvation!

Psalm 18:46 The LORD lives! Blessed be my Rock! Let the God of my salvation be exalted

Psalm 28:1 To You I will cry, O LORD my Rock: Do not be silent to me, Lest, if You are silent to me, I become like those who go down to the pit

Isaiah 44:8 Do not fear, nor be afraid; Have I not told you from that time, and declared it? You are My witnesses. Is there a God besides Me? Indeed there is no other Rock; I know not one.’”

Isaiah 51:1 “Listen to Me, you who follow after righteousness, You who seek the LORD: Look to the rock from which you were hewn, And to the hole of the pit from which you were dug

yes, the 1st century writers of the Scriptures knew exactly who the “Rock” was and what rock the community was to be built on.

Mt 7:21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ 24 “Therefore whoever hears these sayings of Mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man who built his house on the rock: 25 and the rain descended, the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house; and it did not fall, for it was founded on the rock. 26 “But everyone who hears these sayings of Mine, and does not do them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand

Luke 6:46 “But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say? 47 Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like: 48 He is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. And when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently against that house, and could not shake it, for it was founded on the rock. 49 But he who heard and did nothing is like a man who built a house on the earth without a foundation, against which the stream beat vehemently; and immediately it fell. And the ruin of that house was great.”

Luke 8:13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away

1 Cor 10:1 For, brothers, I don't want you to miss the significance of what happened to our fathers. All of them were guided by the pillar of cloud, and they all passed through the sea, 2 and in connection with the cloud and with the sea they all immersed themselves into Moshe, 3 also they all ate the same food from the Spirit, 4 and they all drank the same drink from the Spirit - for they drank from a Spirit-sent Rock which followed them, and that Rock was the Messiah

Hears & Doers = community on the rock

Hearers but not Doers = community built upon sand

James 1:22 Don't deceive yourselves by only hearing what the Word says, but do it! 23 For whoever hears the Word but doesn't do what it says is like someone who looks at his face in a mirror, 24 who looks at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like. 25 But if a person looks closely into the perfect Torah, which gives freedom, and continues, becoming not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work it requires, then he will be blessed in what he does.

Ps 135:13 ADONAI, your name continues forever, your renown, ADONAI, through all generations. 14 For ADONAI will vindicate his people, he will take pity on his servants. 15 The idols of the nations are mere silver and gold, made by human hands. 16 They have mouths, but they can't speak; they have eyes, but they can't see; 17 they have ears, but they can't listen; and they have no breath in their mouths; 18 The people who make them will become like them, along with everyone who trusts in them

And YHVH will end with the one that is so blatantly obvious

Ez 3:1 He said to me, "Human being, eat what you see in front of you; eat this scroll. Then go and speak to the house of Isra'el." 2 So I opened my mouth, and he gave me the scroll to eat, 3 as he said, "Human being, eat this scroll I am giving you; fill your insides with it." When I ate it, it tasted as sweet as honey. 4 "Human being," he said to me, "go to the house of Isra'el, and speak my words to them. 5 For you are not being sent to a people with a difficult language and unintelligible speech, but to the house of Isra'el - 6 not to many peoples with difficult languages and unintelligible speech, whose words you can't understand when you hear them. Without doubt, if I sent you to them, they would listen to you. 7 But the house of Isra'el will not be willing to listen to you, because they aren't willing to listen to me; since all the house of Isra'el are obstinate and hardhearted. 8 However, I am making you as defiant and obstinate as they are. 9 Yes, I am making your resoluteness harder than flint, as hard as a diamond. So don't be afraid of them or depressed by how they look at you, because they are a rebellious house." 10 Then he said to me, "Human being, receive in your heart and hear with your ears all my words that I speak to you. 11 Then go to the exiles, to your countrymen; and speak to them. Tell them, 'Here is what Adonai ELOHIM, says,' whether they listen or not."

You do realize that this prophesy pertains to today don't you? The only scroll in from of him was the "TORAH"! Are you listening?

165 posted on 10/20/2011 3:14:42 PM PDT by patlin ("Knowledge is a powerful source that is 2nd to none but God" ConstitutionallySpeaking 2011)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 161 | View Replies ]


To: patlin
You keep jumping around without answering questions.

lets go back to post 163 Does the “church” have the power to intercede for forgiveness of sin of an individual member?

I answerd your question with Scripture. Do you accept that answer? If not, Why not?

166 posted on 10/20/2011 3:31:49 PM PDT by FatherofFive (Islam is evil and must be eradicated)
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