Do we laugh or cry at these statements? So, the scriptures only lead us to being Arian or some other error???
Save the outrage. It is unbecoming. I will supply some examples since you apparently cannot find any:
John 20: 17 Jesus said to her, "Stop holding on to me, 10 for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and tell them, 'I am going to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.'" ...
21 14 (Jesus) said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, so I send you." 22 15 And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, "Receive the holy Spirit.
Just as the Apostles are subordinate to Jesus, these verses say that He is subordinate to His God, right? And the Holy Spirit is simply His messenger?
John 14: 28 13 You heard me tell you, 'I am going away and I will come back to you.' If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father; for the Father is greater than I. 29 And now I have told you this before it happens, so that when it happens you may believe. 30 I will no longer speak much with you, for the ruler of the world 14 is coming. He has no power over me, 31 but the world must know that I love the Father and that I do just as the Father has commanded me. Get up, let us go.
The Father commands Jesus, who obeys. Subordinationist? How else do you explain it?
Another typical attack on scripture by Roman defenders.
If you guys would only pay attention to what the Bible actually says instead of making it all up as you go...
We are told that the VERY WORD OF GOD is insufficient and we must believe apocryphal fables, forgeries, and lies starting with the Author who was certainly NOT James. Writings condemned by a Pope, now contain the real truth!!!
Dude, show me proof who wrote the four Gospels. Show me proof who wrote Jude. Show me who the various Johns were. Prove to me Peter wrote both of his epistles. And while you are at it, prove that Paul actually wrote more than half of the books attributed to him.
Dude! I am very surprised to see you hawking these same doubts and unscriptural beliefs. How many times have we gone over this now???
The council that "defined" the trinity only put in formal writing what was already written throughout the Bible and believed by the church. Jesus had a subordinational role only so far as his humanity and his mission determined. You cannot deny that both the OT and the NT including the Gospels and the epistles teach over and over that Jesus IS God in the flesh. Since we do not worship multiple gods - because there only is one true God -- then if Jesus is God then he is equal to God Almighty. It didn't take a council hundreds of years to "decide" that God was a triune God. It was in Scripture all along.
If Jesus is subordinate to God then follow the example given that the woman submits to her husband as her husband submits to Christ as Christ submits to God. Scripture says there is no male or female in Christ but that we are all equal. So Christ is also equal to God. Any subordination was as it concerned position and purpose. It does not mean that Jesus was not God.
Finally, how much longer will you cling to the distrust of Holy Scripture? You have been reading the wrong books or websites if you presume we can have no confidence in the authorship of the Scriptures. Read this and get back to me.