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To: Natural Law; daniel1212; Cronos; kosta50; Notwithstanding; Quix; Alex Murphy
You really, really look foolish ranting about nonexistent doctrines.

I give my sources unlike many Catholics who just recite one father or another to suit their interest. What is really foolishness is for Catholics to think they know the Church views and yet never have spent any time reading the Catholic encyclopedia New Advent.

There are numerous calls for alms giving in Scripture.

That wasn't the issue. The issue was paying for someone to get out of purgatory. How many scripture verses says that?

Again, as I posted earlier, there have only been two instances of a Pope speaking infallibly.

Does this include the Pope who declared that what he was saying was infallible? That means there was only one other Pope left who spoke infallibly. I hope that was Peter.

Hey, Alex! Here is another opportunity for you to prance and gloat over the zotting of Bronx2. Harley screwed up and pinged him.

I'm not aware of who Bronx2 is. He was in your post and as a courtesy I ping everyone in the post. So if I "screwed" up it was only because I was mimicking you.

136 posted on 05/27/2011 6:12:05 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD

This may be of interest:

No Catholic can say he knows how many times (total) a Pope or the Magisterium has spoken infallibly, as no infallible list of all such exists, nor can he say he infallibly understands what they declare.

[RC apologist Scott] Hahn has proposed a two-statement canon of ex cathedra papal statements. But apologist Tim Staples says there are at least four, and likely very many more. In his audio tape series, “All Generations Shall Call Me Blessed,” he berated those who state that popes have only spoken infallibly on two occasions. Staples mentioned the two ex cathedra statements to which Hahn refers, and then adds at least two more, referring first to pope Boniface VIII’s statement Unam Sanctam (1302), and second, to St. Leo’s letter to Flavian* which was examined and approved by the Council of Chalcedon in 451:

As evidence that the dilemma is not limited merely to a few teachings, the Roman Catholic is invited to consider the much longer list compiled by Roman Catholic priest Leslie Rumble in his book, That Catholic Church. In this book he provides his opinion that there have been 18 ex cathedra papal statements throughout Roman Catholic history. Not only does Rumble’s list contain considerably more statements than Hahn’s or Staples’, it also contains two caveats indicating that the degree of certainty of the reliability of this (or any) list is in doubted. - http://www.cwrc-rz.org/thlarchive/thla-024.php

Bishop Vincent Gasser, spokesman for the deputation “de fide” (the committee of Conciliar Fathers [in Vatican 1], charged with drafting the solemn definition [on Papal infalliblity]), and who is quoted no less than four times in the official footnotes to “Lumen Gentium” 25, which treats of infallibility, delivered a four-hour speech explaining and defending the draft which was submitted to the assembled Fathers for their vote.

Gasser stated:

“Already thousands and thousands of dogmatic judgments have gone forth from the apostolic See; by his audience— that there had already been “thousands and thousands” of infallible definitions issued by the Roman See.” http://www.orthodoxanswers.org/papalinfallibility.pdf


141 posted on 05/27/2011 7:22:49 PM PDT by daniel1212 ( "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out," Acts 3:19)
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To: HarleyD
"I give my sources..."

That's the beauty of the internet, isn't it, given enough time you can always find an "expert" who agrees with you. Unlike those who profess to speak for all of Protestantism, I don't claim to speak for all who claim to be Catholic. I only state the teachings of the Church to rectify the misstatements and lies represented as Catholic teaching.

Since you "give your sources" please cite the Catholic source that approved the "get out of purgatory" payments. Take your time, the internet is an awfully big place.

142 posted on 05/27/2011 8:01:06 PM PDT by Natural Law
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To: HarleyD

Great job.

Holler if you want some gifs for illustration!


146 posted on 05/27/2011 10:19:31 PM PDT by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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