I understand completely. That I think is one of the tragic consequences of the Reformation. Let me try to explain.
It used to be that sacrifice was the way we gave adoration to God. Not just prayer, but primarily sacrifice. Cain and Abel made sacrificial offerings. Abraham the same. And when the Romans were trying to smoke out the Christians, they didn't just say "pray to Minerva", they tried to make them sacrifice to Minerva.
Now Christianity had sacrifices and altars as well, since the very beginning. The offering was of course not bulls or goats but the Eucharist, but it was still regarded as a true and proper sacrifice. This changed with Martin Luther. The only kind of offering he would admit was the sacrifice of praise and worship. So what happened in Protestantism was a total abandonment of the idea of the Eucharistic sacrifice in favor of personal prayer.
This is why we do not see eye to eye on veneration of the saints anymore. Because the Protestant, whose only offering to God is one of prayer, sees the Catholic praying to saints and honoring them, and thinks "Aha! They give to the saints what they should be giving only to God! That's idolatry!"
But he forgets that he only is looking at half the picture.
To us, prayer is just a method of communication. I pray to Our Lady because she doesn't have a PO Box or a telephone number. I do know where she lives though. She's in God's house, and the Master of that house hears all of my prayers. So if I pray, I trust that God will hear my prayers, and forward them along to her. That's it. Do I kiss images of Mary? Of course. I'd also kiss a photo of my wife. And as for the bowing down stuff, well heck, I bow down to lots of people. I've bowed to a lady when I am feeling particularly chivalrous. These are gestures of respect and honor--not divinity.
Quite simply, reverence is not adoration. Adoration is offering sacrifice to God. And our sacrifice--the Eucharist--is never, ever, ever, offered to the saints. Check the text of the Mass if you like. The Mass is always, always, always, offered to God and God alone. It's never offered to Mary, or St. Joseph, or anyone else. Just God.
So there is an immense gulf between how a Catholic worships God and honors Mary. Infinite, even.
I understand completely. That I think is one of the tragic consequences of the Reformation. Let me try to explain. It used to be that sacrifice was the way we gave adoration to God. Not just prayer, but primarily sacrifice. Cain and Abel made sacrificial offerings. Abraham the same. And when the Romans were trying to smoke out the Christians, they didn't just say "pray to Minerva", they tried to make them sacrifice to Minerva.
We are not told by Moses the exact instruction given Able and Cain as to 'what' made the acceptable sacrifice. What we can learn is that Abel's sacrifice was acceptable and pleased the Father. So it is NOT a leap of faith to believe, even though the words are not specifically given, that Able listen and fulfilled a specific instruction... WHY? Because it is unnatural in the most perfect sense of 'judgment' for the child to NOT be instructed as to what specifically is required from them. And since the beginning of this flesh age we are instructed that more than the majority did things their own way and even expected their own ways to be acceptable. NOT a whole lot has changed all these many years later.
Now Christianity had sacrifices and altars as well, since the very beginning. The offering was of course not bulls or goats but the Eucharist, but it was still regarded as a true and proper sacrifice. This changed with Martin Luther. The only kind of offering he would admit was the sacrifice of praise and worship. So what happened in Protestantism was a total abandonment of the idea of the Eucharistic sacrifice in favor of personal prayer.
Up until Christ's death, there was a requirement of a blood sacrifice by the priests for atonement of 'sin'. But until His death NOT one could be offered the 'grace' of salvation. There were specific requirements as to what and the condition thereof to make the acceptable sacrifice, and only Christ in the body of a flesh being, perfect, never sinned could be that acceptable sacrifice. Mary was merely the flesh vessel by which the process through which Emanuel, means, God with us, would pass though this flesh age.
Moses lost two sons because they polluted the altar, and the priest were given to wearing bells of sorts around their ankles so it would be know if they survived the process of offering a sacrifice. And at NO time was any other flesh child ever required to be offered as a blood sacrifice for any purpose. (Yes, I am familiar with the test of Abraham's faith in the case of his willingness to offer Isaac, but the sacrifice NEVER took place.
This is why we do not see eye to eye on veneration of the saints anymore. Because the Protestant, whose only offering to God is one of prayer, sees the Catholic praying to saints and honoring them, and thinks "Aha! They give to the saints what they should be giving only to God! That's idolatry!"
Not one of us has anything to do with who is or is not a 'saint'. Paul says in Ephesians 1:4 According as He hat chosen (election) us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love.
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself,
according to the good pleasure of His will,.....
Mary fits this predestination as much as any of the individuals we are told about throughout the Word. So the choosing and electing already has taken place as to who was and is the saints. BUT only one flesh being could conceive, and bring forth Emanuel, means, God with us. AND Mary was given NO power or authority to command anyone to do anything. The word predestination has as much weight as the word grace, and disregarding the meaning of predestination diminishes what grace literally means.
Revelation 19:5 - 10 describes a 'voice' out of the throne, which would mean this was a 'divine' voice, and John reacts by falling at his feet to worship him, and the fellowservant orders John to NOT worship him. So IF a voice from out of the throne, came from a fellowservant, upon what basis does Mary get elevated as having a direct connection for us to the Heavenly Father.
Most especially when we have already been told the Heavenly Father knows what we think and He needs no one to message our thoughts and prayers? This notion over venerating another fellowservant does not come from Christ or the Heavenly Father.
But he forgets that he only is looking at half the picture. To us, prayer is just a method of communication. I pray to Our Lady because she doesn't have a PO Box or a telephone number. I do know where she lives though. She's in God's house, and the Master of that house hears all of my prayers. So if I pray, I trust that God will hear my prayers, and forward them along to her. That's it. Do I kiss images of Mary? Of course. I'd also kiss a photo of my wife. And as for the bowing down stuff, well heck, I bow down to lots of people. I've bowed to a lady when I am feeling particularly chivalrous. These are gestures of respect and honor--not divinity.
Every aspect of the religion demonstrates far more time, prayers and study is devoted to Mary than the Creator.
Quite simply, reverence is not adoration. Adoration is offering sacrifice to God. And our sacrifice--the Eucharist--is never, ever, ever, offered to the saints. Check the text of the Mass if you like. The Mass is always, always, always, offered to God and God alone. It's never offered to Mary, or St. Joseph, or anyone else. Just God. So there is an immense gulf between how a Catholic worships God and honors Mary. Infinite, even..
Wonder how much of this 'study', adoration and veneration is going to be a part of what gets taught in the yet future appointed time Ezekiel describes is going to be done?
Now Christianity had sacrifices and altars as well, since the very beginning. The offering was of course not bulls or goats but the Eucharist, but it was still regarded as a true and proper sacrifice. This changed with Martin Luther. The only kind of offering he would admit was the sacrifice of praise and worship. So what happened in Protestantism was a total abandonment of the idea of the Eucharistic sacrifice in favor of personal prayer.
CHRISTIANITY does not have altars and sacrifices. Catholicism does. You ought not to conflate the two.
Christianity is not about sacrifices (present tense) but a done sacrifice. It's about one once for all time, finished, completed, never need to be repeated sacrifice.
What the Reformation got right was getting away from the continuation of sacrifice and focusing on the *It is FINISHED* part.
Communion is the remembrance of the once for all, one time, finished sacrifice. Anyone who teaches that sacrifice is still ongoing and that ongoing is necessary for salvation is wrong. It is not Scriptural.
The book of Hebrews addresses much of the teaching of the Catholic church. Sadly the Catholic church has decided to ignore it and teach contrary.
Hebrews 10
1For since the law has but a shadow of the good things to come instead of the true form of these realities, it can never, by the same sacrifices that are continually offered every year, make perfect those who draw near. 2Otherwise, would they not have ceased to be offered, since the worshipers, having once been cleansed, would no longer have any consciousness of sins? 3But in these sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. 4For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.
5Consequently, when Christ came into the world, he said,
"Sacrifices and offerings you have not desired, but a body have you prepared for me; 6in burnt offerings and sin offerings you have taken no pleasure. 7Then I said, 'Behold, I have come to do your will, O God, as it is written of me in the scroll of the book.'"
8When he said above, "You have neither desired nor taken pleasure in sacrifices and offerings and burnt offerings and sin offerings" (these are offered according to the law), 9then he added, "Behold, I have come to do your will." He does away with the first in order to establish the second. 10And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
11And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, 13waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. 14For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.
15And the Holy Spirit also bears witness to us; for after saying,
16 "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,"
17then he adds,
"I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more."
18Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.
We are forgiven. There is no more need for sacrifice. The penalty for our sin has been completely paid by Christ's death on the cross. That's why He said *It is finished* and the curtain in the Temple was torn in two allowing access into the Holy of Holies.