No, He’s not.
Posted on 02/28/2011 5:45:44 PM PST by The Ignorant Fisherman
Lucifer is “at present” setting the final global stage for the world’s reception and worship of “the” Lawless One (Eph. 6:12). This man will be the lawless pinnacle of human depravity and will be exalted far above all the lawless ones that have ever existed before him - in the history of man - by Satan (2 Thess. 2:3-12, Rev. 13). Only one event, the Rapture of the Church of Christ prevents his unmasking and manifestation to a godless Christ rejecting world (2 Thess. 2:5-8, Rev. 6:1-2).
This masterpiece of Satan will absolutely despise ALL that is Almighty God; His ETERNAL Person, His ETERNAL sovereignty, His established ETERNAL RIGHTEOUSNESS, His OMNIPOTENT creative design, and His ordained and established laws and absolutes for time and ETERNITY (Dan. 7:25, Rev. 13: 5-6). Most of all, it will be this man’s burning passion to tyrannically oppose - lock stock and barrel during this seven year period - Almighty God’s Divine and angelic revelation, His signs and wonders, His godly messengers of the glorious gospel of Jesus Messiah and chiefly - Almighty God’s Christ “the Lamb of Almighty God” (Dan. 7: 25, 9:27, 11:36-39, Rev.17:12-14; Rev. 6-19).
This seven year period will be the junction station of the last 4300 years of the godless and lawless rebellion of Noah’s descendants (Gen. 9:1-19, 10, 11). The horrific devastation and global tribulation at this time will bring to the forefront man’s godless rebellion and rejection of Almighty God’s saving grace (2 Thess. 2:10-12). There is nothing like intense tribulation, oppression, and anarchy to bring out that which is in the heart of fallen man (Gen. 6:3, 5, Jer.17:9, Matt. 15:17-20, Gal. 5:19-21).
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Jesus prayed not for us to be taken out of the world, but that we would be kept from the evil one. He taught that in this world we will have tribulation, but to “be of good cheer, I have overcome the world.”
There is a distinction between tribulation from the world and wrath from God. God gives grace to endure the former and deliverance from the latter through faith in His Son (”even Jesus Who saves us from the wrath to come”).
It would seem from the trials of believers throughout the world today and also throughout history, that our relative peace in the West is an anomaly and not the norm even though these are not now part of the trouble of Daniel’s seventieth week.
I think what you said about relying on the Lord’s provision and strength is more important than knowing the timing of Christ’s return. We must watch and be ready, while also waiting patiently through our trials for His return.
I have posted many positive things, just nothing positive regarding dispensational futurism. Usually the things I post which are positive get attacked by the futurists around these parts.
You offer no biblical references, just sarcasm.
Ecclesiastes 3:1.
Or, more likely, there is no millennial reign on the earth for a thousand years. At least there is none recorded in Rev. 20.
BTW, 2 Peter 3 does not say that the "day of the Lord" is a thousand years. You only get that by allegorizing the text. Something, I understand, futurists are opposed to.
I'm glad for your experience. Good people, even good Christians, can, at times, tolerate and propagate untruth.
The notion of a future seven year tribulation during which time billions of people, including millions of Jewish people specifically, will be slaughtered under the direction of the futurist antichrist while the Church sits safely out of reach is one such untruth. It is an idea that was invented by John Nelson Darby in the 1830s. Many people believe it unquestioned out of ignorance. Ignorance is not a good thing.
In Rev. 14 we also see the one hundred and forty four thousand in heaven before the throne. Are these people resurrected (in their bodies)?
Good attitude...I agree. Christ is what it is all about
But.... He is coming to take His church(His body) first.. (the rapture) It's all about restoring Israel in the seven year tribulation to be ready for the 1000 year reign of Messiah (Christ) when he returns (Zech 12-14, Isa. 11).
God's Two Witnesses (Rev. 11:3-16) will take over for the Body of Christ.
Here is my objection:
There are a great many who hang there hat on John 3:16 and 1 Thes 4.
They state “I believe and am therefore saved, I need do nothing else.”
They follow that up with, “In the end times I am Raptured, and have nothing to fear”.
They ignore all the rest of the Bible and believe there are no consequences for their behavior in life.
This is very dangerous for there souls, and they are in danger of being those shouting “Lord, Lord” and hearing, “I do not know you”.
Preparation for this thing has already started. We in the West have kind of missed the boat a bit, but 9/11 was a foretaste and wake-up call.
We are living in an age (Laodicean) like no other. It is an age ripe for Jihadist takeover. Numbers-wise, Europe is well on its way to being overrun by Muslims. Sharia law is knocking on America's door. Many are opening the door and welcoming it in. Islam believes this 12th Imam who will kill Jews and Christians is the second coming of Christ who will explain the Bible was never correct. One of the names in Islamic tradition for this person is the Beast. STRONG DELUSION has already started because they have not received the love of the truth.
Nuclear capabilities are set to fall into the hands of these crazies. We are almost there. Topcat can scoff all he wants but maybe he can try telling that to people like Nick Berg. You either submit to Sharia law and this Imam beast or you lose your head, like the unfortunate Mr. Berg - as simple as that.
Those of us who are believers will be watching from the Heavenly mezzanine. In the meantime, we must be sober, girt about with His truth, and letting our lights shine that as many as possible will come in before that horrific time starts.
In these last days, they key is having your vessel filled with oil as the five wise virgins did (Matt 25:1-13). The foolish virgins ignored their need to be filled with the oil of the Holy Spirit. He is the Spirit of truth withholding this evil for now, and it is He, the Holy Spirit, who we need to be constantly filled with to help us through to His coming.
God Bless.
” I believe it will unfortunately be a tragic correction of those expecting His return to provide for their escape from tribulation, and as such this error will lead many to despair when they find it does not happen as they have been incorrectly taught.”
Amen. The despair and consequent loss of faith will be the fruit of the error.
Proverbs 17:14 The beginning of strife is like letting out water,So abandon the quarrel before it breaks out.
Proverbs 13:10 Through insolence comes nothing but strife,But wisdom is with those who receive counsel.
Proverbs 15:18 A hot-tempered man stirs up strife,But the slow to anger calms a dispute.
Proverbs 17:19 He who loves transgression loves strife;He who raises his door seeks destruction.
Proverbs 26:21 Like charcoal to hot embers and wood to fire,So is a contentious man to kindle strife.
Proverbs 28:25 An arrogant man stirs up strife,But he who trusts in the LORD will prosper.
Proverbs 29:22 An angry man stirs up strife,And a hot-tempered man abounds in transgression.
Proverbs 30:33 For the churning of milk produces butter,And pressing the nose brings forth blood;So the churning of anger produces strife.
Romans1:28-30 And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,
Romans 13:13,14 13 Let us behave properly as in the day, not in carousing and drunkenness, not in sexual promiscuity and sensuality, not in strife and jealousy. 14But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh in regard to its lusts.
2 Corinthians 12:20 For I am afraid that perhaps when I come I may find you to be not what I wish and may be found by you to be not what you wish; that perhaps there will be strife, jealousy, angry tempers, disputes, slanders, gossip, arrogance, disturbances;
Galatians 5:19-21 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, 21envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Philippians 1:14-16 and that most of the brethren, trusting in the Lord because of my imprisonment, have far more courage to speak the word of God without fear. Some, to be sure, are preaching Christ even from envy and strife, but some also from good will; the latter do it out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel;
1 Timothy 6 1All who are under the yoke as slaves are to regard their own masters as worthy of all honor so that the name of God and our doctrine will not be spoken against. 2Those who have believers as their masters must not be disrespectful to them because they are brethren, but must serve them all the more, because those who partake of the benefit are believers and beloved Teach and preach these principles. 3If anyone advocates a different doctrine and does not agree with sound words, those of our Lord Jesus Christ, and with the doctrine conforming to godliness, 4he is conceited and understands nothing; but he has a morbid interest in controversial questions and disputes about words, out of which arise envy, strife, abusive language, evil suspicions, 5and constant friction between men of depraved mind and deprived of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. 6But godliness actually is a means of great gain when accompanied by contentment.
Proverbs 1:22 "How long, O naive ones, will you love being simple-minded?And scoffers delight themselves in scoffing And fools hate knowledge?
Proverbs 18:6 A fool's lips bring strife,And his mouth calls for blows.
Proverbs 20:3 Keeping away from strife is an honor for a man,But any fool will quarrel.
Proverbs 3:35 The wise will inherit honor,But fools display dishonor.
Proverbs 10:8 The wise of heart will receive commands,But a babbling fool will be ruined.
Proverbs 11:29 He who troubles his own house will inherit wind,And the foolish will be servant to the wisehearted.
Proverbs 12:6 A fool's anger is known at once,But a prudent man conceals dishonor.
Proverbs 12:23 A prudent man conceals knowledge,But the heart of fools proclaims folly.
Proverbs 13:16 Every prudent man acts with knowledge,But a fool displays folly.
Proverbs 14:16 A wise man is cautious and turns away from evil,But a fool is arrogant and careless.
Proverbs 15:2 The tongue of the wise makes knowledge acceptable,But the mouth of fools spouts folly.
Proverbs 15:14 The mind of the intelligent seeks knowledge,But the mouth of fools feeds on folly.
Proverbs 17:7 Excellent speech is not fitting for a fool,Much less are lying lips to a prince.
Proverbs 18:2A fool does not delight in understanding,But only in revealing his own mind.
Proverbs 18:6 A fool's lips bring strife,And his mouth calls for blows.
Proverbs 19:29 Judgments are prepared for scoffers,And blows for the back of fools.
Proverbs 20:3 Keeping away from strife is an honor for a man,But any fool will quarrel.
Proverbs 26:11 Like a dog that returns to its vomitIs a fool who repeats his folly.
Proverbs 27:3 A stone is heavy and the sand weighty,But the provocation of a fool is heavier than both of them.
Proverbs 29:9 When a wise man has a controversy with a foolish man,The foolish man either rages or laughs, and there is no rest.
Ecclesiastes 7:6 For as the crackling of thorn bushes under a pot,So is the laughter of the fool;And this too is futility
Ecclesiastes 7:9 Do not be eager in your heart to be angry,For anger resides in the bosom of fools.
Ecclesiastes 10:12 Words from the mouth of a wise man are gracious, while the lips of a fool consume him
Proverbs 17:14 The beginning of strife is like letting out water,So abandon the quarrel before it breaks out.
Proverbs 20:3 Keeping away from strife is an honor for a man,But any fool will quarrel.
1 Corinthians 1:11 For I have been informed concerning you, my brethren, by Chloe's people, that there are quarrels among you.
2 Timothy 2:23, 24 But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels. The Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged,
Proverbs 6:14 Who with perversity in his heart continually devises evil,Who spreads strife.
Proverbs 6:18-20 A heart that devises wicked plans, Feet that run rapidly to evil, 19A false witness who utters lies, And one who spreads strife among brothers. 20My son, observe the commandment of your father And do not forsake the teaching of your mother;
Proverbs 10:12 Hatred stirs up strife,But love covers all transgressions.
Proverbs 16:28 A perverse man spreads strife,And a slanderer separates intimate friends.
Proverbs 22:10 Drive out the scoffer, and contention will go out,Even strife and dishonor will cease.
You make many assumptions, AND THEY'RE WRONG.
Just because someone believes John 3:16, just because they believe they are saved and have "fire insurance" doesn't mean they feel they need to do nothing else. In fact, just the fact that you state that, speaks to me of your own arrogance, to feel that someone who doesn't agree with your point of view on a particular subject, is somehow inferior or less godly. THERE ARE MANY christians who believe in once saved always saved and the rapture of the church, who aren't "simply waiting" for Gods return. In fact MOST of the people I know in this group, seriously believe time is running out, to evangelize the world. They believe that salvation isn't the end of their christian walk, BUT THE BEGINNING.
DO christians sin? Sure.
Do christians continue on in the same sins? Yes.
Does that mean they are unrepentent? Not necessarily.
I believe John 3:16 and 1 Thess 4. But I spend most of my time reading everything but those verses. In fact, I probably read Proverbs more than any other single section of the Bible. Its a mirror by which I look at my own life, to see if my image is there. Unfortunately, what I see in my own life is a terrible reflection. So I constantly read Gods ENTIRE word, that I may conform more to his image.
You claim that "There are a great many who hang there hat on John 3:16 and 1 Thes 4. They state “I believe and am therefore saved, I need do nothing else.” They follow that up with, “In the end times I am Raptured, and have nothing to fear”. They ignore all the rest of the Bible and believe there are no consequences for their behavior in life." Which leads me to assume you're not of this group, which means that your exposure to people like me is probably pretty small. But I am of this group, and my exposure to this group is huge, and I don't find the majority of them to be as you describe, in fact just the opposite.
Oh that futurists would be as quick to chastise their errant brethren who invent all sorts of whackadocio ideas just by reading the daily newspaper.
Futurists are the progenitors of “foolish controversies” in our day. Someone must oppose them by standing for the truth.
Revelation 14:1Then I looked, and behold, the Lamb was standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads. 2And I heard a voice from heaven, like the sound of many waters and like the sound of loud thunder, and the voice which I heard was like the sound of harpists playing on their harps.
You avoided my question, but I suspect by quoting this verse that you are obviously not familiar with all the Bible, esp. where it speaks of the heavenly Mount Zion in Heb. 12:22. The heavenly Mount Zion is a present reality, and the dwelling place of Christ and His saints, along with a company of angels.
22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels,
23 to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect,
In fact, here is the entire context of Rev. 14 so you can see the setting.
1 Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father's name written on their foreheads.So you can see from the context the setting is heaven. The 24 elders and living creatures of chapter 7 are in heaven, not on earth, per v. 3. The one hundred and forty-four thousand are situated before the throne of God in heaven per v. 5. It must be heaven according to your futurist theory about the tribulation, because this chapter is set in the midst of the tribulation when Christ is still on His throne in heaven.
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, like the voice of many waters, and like the voice of loud thunder. And I heard the sound of harpists playing their harps.
3 They sang as it were a new song before the throne, before the four living creatures, and the elders; and no one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth.
4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.
5 And in their mouth was found no deceit, for they are without fault before the throne of God.
So let me try this again and think about it for more than 2 seconds before jumping to a conclusion. (I realize the true answer may be painful for you to accept.)
In Rev. 14 we also see the one hundred and forty four thousand in heaven before the throne. Are these people resurrected (in their bodies)?
The Bible does not speak of a “Laodicean age.” That is another invention of futurism. Like dispensations within dispensations. It’s what you get when a futurist allegorizes the Bible to their own end.
Topcat can scoff all he wants but maybe he can try telling that to people
I do not scoff at real political situations. I do not scoff at what the Bible truly teaches. What I scoff at are the religion prognosticators who try to pigeon hole modern events into their whacky prophetic system. What I scoff at are folks who use nutty ideas like a “Laodicean age” (which is unknown in the Bible) to attempt to justify their whacky system.
If you’re going to talk about me, at least get it straight.
No, He’s not.
You mean after millions of unbelieving Jews, futurism’s “earthly chosen people,” are slaughtered while the Church, futurism’s “heavenly chosen people,” sits in heavenly bliss?
I never said the Bible uses the phrase "Laodicean age", but it never uses the phrase "trinity" either. You tell me that everything Jesus speaks of concerning the church at Laodicea isn't a precise description of not only today's church but also the age we're living in. We live in an age unlike no other that has kicked God out (hence the picture of Jesus on the outside knocking on the door).
It seems from what you wrote that you scoff at the idea that the end of the age is near and His coming is imminent. As I've pointed out, you don't have to look very far to see that we are building quickly to annihilation such as has never been seen before.
One of the mysteries of this Divine Comedy is, how did Lucifer ever think he could get away with it?
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