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And just who jumped in on this thread with posts that got deleted?

Who behaved badly on this thread is of little concern to me; the trend goes well beyond this thread.

You mean like Catholics calling us scum? And bigots? [...] Then you need to take that up with the Catholics on FR. They're the ones calling us anti-Catholic and bigot, etc. We don't call ourselves that.

I know you don't call yourselves that... and it's not a charge that ought be leveled on all of you. But I'm certainly going to agree that it deserves to be leveled against some of you. Enough Catholics here have seen anti-Catholic bigotry (in Real life, not just on FR) to recognize it and call it for what it is. If you want to talk about it more, PM me.

Could you be more specific about what you consider slander in the article?

Slander is the wrong word. The accusations that Ryle and Latimer make against the Catholic Church are half-truths. They point out what may well have been legitimate abuses (uneducated priests, lack of preaching, corruption in the Vatican, etc.); However, they also paint things inherent to the Catholic system such as the Mass, the priesthood, penance and the other Sacraments, the veneration of relics, and other things that are inherent to the Apostolic Faith (the Orthodox do them too) as part of that corrupt system. Indeed these things are not part of the corrupt system, as they are part of the Catholic Faith received from the Apostles.

In addition to this is the idea that the Bible in Vernacular was somehow contrary to Catholicism - indeed, it was only prohibited to produce a translation without the approval of the Church, not for there to be an English translation of Scripture. In fact, the Church even took no issue with Wyclyffe's translation, provided that the Catholics who owned copies of it removed his heretical commentaries. I'll just leave this here for anyone interested in reading more.

No, I will not defend it beyond that, because EACH of those things would require a whole thread to be intelligently discussed. Besides this, each HAS ALREADY BEEN defended by Catholics on FR, ad nauseam. My doing so again will do no good.

It's already Sunday morning where I am. I don't have time to discuss it any more.

Thanks for this post.

Who behaved badly on this thread is of little concern to me; the trend goes well beyond this thread.

I wouldn't expect it to since the Catholics are the ones piling on the nastiness.

If it's little concern, why are you chastising the non-Catholics then.

Your actions say otherwise.

Slander is the wrong word. The accusations that Ryle and Latimer make against the Catholic Church are half-truths.

Were any of the FRoman Catholics there to verify what the say happened in the day in which Latimer was living? He was there. On what basis do you know that he was lying? You must have some documentation to back yourself up.

Ryle was much closer to the situation in time as well.

Enough Catholics here have seen anti-Catholic bigotry (in Real life, not just on FR) to recognize it and call it for what it is. If you want to talk about it more, PM me.

And likewise, I've had enough Catholics in real life tell me that I'm wrong for following Bible teachings and that I'm going to go to hell for it, both in real life and on FR.

It doesn't bother me in the least. My salvation is not based on church affiliation and I know that, but I don't expect most Catholics to know, or admit that. I was raised Catholic in an extended Catholic family, which included priests and a nun, grew up with Catholic classmates, worked with Catholic co-workers.

Catholics do not make any secret of what they really believe so I know what on the ground, grassroots lay Catholics think and believe about their faith. Sometimes it's different from actual CCC teaching. Often it's not.

Christian does not by default mean Catholic. Catholic does not by default mean Christian. They are not synonymous.

There are Christians in all denominations and Christians who belong to none. There are non-Christians in all denominations.

What God desires is a relationship with Him, not an adherence to a laundry list of legalistic do's and don't's - of which the Catholic church is not the only guilty party in that respect by any means. Any church that says that membership in it or following THEIR own rules and regs is what gets you into heaven is just as bad, and I've attended Baptist churches that can give the best of the Pharisees a run for their money as far as legalism is concerned.

FWIW, even Pentecostals have their own brand of legalism. They just don't recognize it or admit it.

Slander is the wrong word. The accusations that Ryle and Latimer make against the Catholic Church are half-truths. They point out what may well have been legitimate abuses (uneducated priests, lack of preaching, corruption in the Vatican, etc.); However, they also paint things inherent to the Catholic system such as the Mass, the priesthood, penance and the other Sacraments, the veneration of relics, and other things that are inherent to the Apostolic Faith (the Orthodox do them too) as part of that corrupt system. Indeed these things are not part of the corrupt system, as they are part of the Catholic Faith received from the Apostles.

And you know that how?