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To: D-fendr

Exactly, change cannot happen without time.

Therefore, the First Cause argument comes up short.

Being outside of time implies a “forever-ness”. Any change in that state that causes the creation of something, requires time to have been operative even before the change in the situation occurred, so that change could occur.

Confusing, I know, but that is the paradox.


393 posted on 01/18/2011 6:50:59 PM PST by James C. Bennett (An Australian.)
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To: James C. Bennett
I think I see why you're not seeing this correctly. :)

Being outside of time implies a “forever-ness”

No, no, no. Not in this use of eternal. Eternal in this use does not mean never-ending. It means outside time - no beginning, middle, end comes into play. Nothing dealing with time applies. Outside time. Transcending time might be an easier term to grasp.

396 posted on 01/18/2011 7:12:06 PM PST by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: James C. Bennett; D-fendr
Therefore, the First Cause argument comes up short

Correct. The paradox is that the god-of-gaps crowd claims God doesn't change yet God intercedes. Logic tells us that God wasn't always creating...

417 posted on 01/18/2011 10:43:05 PM PST by kosta50 ("Spirit of Spirit...give me over to immortal birth so that I may be born again" -- Mithral prayer)
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