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To: CynicalBear; Quix; ReformedBeckite
Maybe you should just do more study. [...] 1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Are you saying this passage supports pre-tribulation rapture? The preceding verse makes it clear that this rapture happens at the time Christ comes to judge dead:

1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

So I repeat, you have nothing of substance to support the 180-year-old pretrib rapture theory.

279 posted on 01/16/2011 10:25:14 PM PST by mas cerveza por favor
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To: mas cerveza por favor; Amityschild; Brad's Gramma; Captain Beyond; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; ...
So I repeat, you have nothing of substance to support the 180-year-old pretrib rapture theory.


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THIS
from folks of
The Vatican Alice In Wonderland School of Theology and Reality Mangling
who base such dogma, beliefs, rituals, compulsions, as

1. Christ exiting Mary's womb leaving her hymen intact;

2. Mary is crowned Queen of heaven and earth, dispenser of all graces . . .

3. [Ferraro p32 #4]: She became Queen of Purgatory, where she exercises her power as mediatrix in behalf of these suffering souls.

4. [Ferraro p32 #6]:6 - She became the ruler of hell, that trembles at her slightest gaze and is defeated by her power.


5.

"Just as a rock extracted from earth will precipitate into the abyss, so will man, left without Mary's help, quickly slide toward hell." --Richard of St Victor

6.

p37
Sacred Heart of Jesus, Thy kingdom come; Thy kingdom come through Mary! --Partial Indulgence


7.

p41
"Mary is the tree of life to those who grasp her, and he is happy who hold her fast." --Prov. 3:18


8. [Ferraro p43 #1]:

p43
1 - "Hail Mary, beloved daughter of the Father, Mother of the Divine Son, Spouse of the Holy Spirit, complement of the most august Trinity!"


9. [Ferraro p45 #6]:

p45
6 - To her was granted grace greater than that conferred upon all others, 'that she might vanquish sin in every respect.' [Qx: I guess Christ's vanquishing sin was unnecessary--or ineffectual without Mary's assistance?]

10. [Ferraro p46 #7]:p46
7 - "Mary is the dawn of God because, just as the dawn marks the end of darkness and the beginning of day, so Mary indicates the end of vices and the beginning of virtue." [Qx: I guess Christ's conquering on The Cross and HIS conquering trip to hell were unncessary?]


11. [Ferraro p46 #9]:

9 - God loved Mary so much that He gave her the keys to His heart. 'No one can go to God without Mary drawing him.' [Qx: I guess Holy Spirit has been relegated to a 'Walter Mitty' role as spouse of Mary? That's SOME POWER to cancel & take over HOLY SPIRIT'S role to draw men to God!]

12. [Ferraro p47 #4]:

p47
4 - "Mary, trusting in the word of the angel, destroyed the sin Eve committed by trusting in the serpent.' [Qx: Evidently, she beat Christ to the job of vanquishing sin!]


13. [Ferraro p47 #5]:

5 - "She desired the safety of everyone, went in search of it, and obtained it; it was also through her that this salvation was wrought." [QX: What an unnecessary waste of precious Blood and suffering on THE CROSS!!!/sar]

14. [Ferraro p47 #10]:

p47
10 - "As Noah's Ark saved all the animals that entered it, so Mary saves all the souls that entrust themselves to her care."

15. [Ferraro p50 #8]:

p50
8 - "If she were not so holy as she is, how could God appoint her to be the ladder of Paradise, the advocate of the world, meatrix between HIm and us?"


16. [Ferraro p50 #4]:

p50
4 - "By becoming Mother of God, Mary belongs to the order of hypostatic union; hence she participates IN the infinite sanctity of God."

From:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2503880/posts?page=1576#1576

17. The farcical fantasy that the Vatican Alice In Wonderland School Of Theology and Reality Mangling formed after 300AD was formed hundreds of years earlier "founded on Peter" instead of the Biblical declaration that Christ would build HIS CHURCH on the TYPE OF FAITH Peter had.

18. The farcical fantasy that the approximately 20% somewhat authentic Roman Catholics out of 1.2 billion self-labeled Roman Catholics comprise the largest group of 'true Christians' in the world.

19. The farcical fantasy that !!!!TRADITIONS!!!! of man and of demons are great things to found a Christian organization on.

20. The farcical fantasy that The Pope & a group of bureaucratic political theological elite magicsterical power-mongers are somehow magically infallible in matters of dogma, faith and practice.

ETC. ETC. ETC. YADA YADA YADA.

All such piled on top of utter empty fantasies based on thin air or at best matrix mangled slivers of tooth picks worth of nuanced single verses of Scripture.

YET
they construe
Proddy assertions
as lacking
"!!!!SUBSTANCE!!!!"



Methinks that
"MASSIVELY INFINITELY HYPOCRITICAL"
is too weak, wimpy, inadequate
a term for such
INSTITUTIONALIZED
BRAZENLY ARROGANT HUBRIS!

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293 posted on 01/16/2011 11:13:03 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: mas cerveza por favor
>> So I repeat, you have nothing of substance to support the 180-year-old pretrib rapture theory.<<

One more time just special for you. Irenaeus was second century which as you know was more the 180 years ago.

Irenaeus
Against Heresies
Book 5, Chapter 29, Paragraph 1

And therefore, when in the end the Church shall be suddenly caught up from this, it is said, “There shall be tribulation such as has not been since the beginning, neither shall be.” Matt. xxiv. 21. For this is the last contest of the righteous, in which, when they overcome they are crowned with incorruption.

Pseudo-Ephraem's Pre Tribulation Rapture Statement (c. 374-627) A Sermon by Pseudo-Ephraem (section 2)

"All the saints and elect of God are gathered together before the tribulation, which is to come, and are taken to the Lord, in order that they may not see at any time the confusion which overwhelms the world because of our sins."

356 posted on 01/17/2011 7:37:57 AM PST by CynicalBear
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