Posted on 12/05/2010 6:14:57 PM PST by RnMomof7
However beloved Mary is due to birthing Jesus, he made clear that fleshly family relationships were very secondary to being “my mother and brothers” by following his commandments.
And yes, there's no shortage of pettiness and meanness displayed on these religion threads. sadly.
Will you also pray to an unnamed Greek woman as your intercessor? Mary's not the only woman who seems to have convince Jesus to do what he had not intended.
As someone else posted on this thread -
Mark 7:24-30
Jesus left that place and went to the vicinity of Tyre. He entered a house and did not want anyone to know it; yet he could not keep his presence secret. In fact, as soon as she heard about him, a woman whose little daughter was possessed by an impure spirit came and fell at his feet. The woman was a Greek, born in Syrian Phoenicia. She begged Jesus to drive the demon out of her daughter.
“First let the children eat all they want,” he told her, “for it is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.”
“Lord,” she replied, “even the dogs under the table eat the children’s crumbs.”
Then he told her, “For such a reply, you may go; the demon has left your daughter.”
She went home and found her child lying on the bed, and the demon gone.
Did it ever occur to Catholics that it could just have been that Mary went to Jesus about the wine not knowing HOW He was going to handle it? We can look at it in hindsight but that colors our perspective. Try putting yourself in that situation without any preconceived notions of what was going to happen.
Marriage suppers were family affairs in those days. It could very well be that somehow Mary was connected with hostessing the supper and when they ran out of wine, she came to Him to have Him deal with procuring more in the normal way, presumably because she knew that if she asked Him to do something, she could trust Him because He had proved Himself dependable.
I don’t think there’s anything in Scripture to indicate that she expected Him to deal with in any way out of the ordinary, that is sending someone out to buy more.
You’re right. And along the lines of your post, I refuse to believe that God “rewarded” Joseph’s obedience by condemning him to have a wife who he was not allowed to touch (So she could remain a perpetual virgin), and further condemning him to remaining childless.
At the risk of being condemned as a blasphemer, some report seeing Mary's image on a piece of burnt toast. Other's have claimed to have seen Elvis working at diners, gas stations and music stores.
This is not intended to "bash." My faith is in Jesus and not the claims of man.
Jesus sought unity in belief of the truth; the ecumenists, on the other hand seek the total destruction of the truth through binding consensus.
What was the purpose of the apostles? To teach scriptures? Write Scriptures? To hand down the Lords messages? Could only those messages have been in writing form?
They wrote, taught, and were inspired by the Holy Spirit. Do you believe that only the written guidance of God are true inspiration or were their acts also guided by the Holy Spirit?
I believe God, Jesus left much more than some selective written words, IE “Traditions”. To believe he only left limited written words seams odd to assume. Does the Bible say it is everything? Where in the bible say these are the books of the bible and that is all?
You left out Ashoreth, the original Ishtar.
St. Irenaeus, Against Heresies (C. 180 A.D.):
“Consequently, then, Mary the Virgin is found to be obedient, saying:’ Behold, O Lord, your handmaid; be it done to me according to your word.’ Eve, however, was disobedient; and when yet a Virgin, she did not obey. So also Mary, betrothed to a man but nevertheless still a virgin, being obedient, was made the cause of salvation for herself and for the whole human race...Thus, the knot of Eve’s disobedience was loosed by the obedience of Mary. What the virgin had bound in unbelief, the Virgin Mary loosed through faith.”
**Does this mean that you don’t believe that Christ was both human and divine? Part of him died? Heresy.**
The scriptures refer to the Christ as the ‘Son of God’, but never ‘God the Son’. There is a dynamic, divine reason for that. But, we’re heading off thread here, so I’ll be brief.
In scripture, we find that Jesus Christ had a soul, that was put into a perishable body, with the Father (Spirit; John 4:24) in him doing “the works” (John 14:10), the miracles, the giving of divine instruction.
“This Jesus hath God raised up...” Acts 2:32
Why create confusion with ‘persons of God’?
What is so bad about just reading it like it is written, for example in Acts 10:38,39,40.
“How God” (hmm..which person?) “anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost” (the so called ‘third person’) “AND with power” (power? uh..now which person is that?). “..whom they slew and hanged on a tree. Him God” (which person or persons) “raised up the third day”.
The type of ecumenism you speak of with regard to the World Council of Churches is NOT what the article speaks of(nor do endorse it either) and is not the UNITY that Jesus calls us to.
Can you not agree that Jesus calls us to unite in HIM, because of a great plan?????
I am not Catholic
very apparent...it is too difficult for many people to become Catholic. However, if you recieved a legitimate baptism, you are a Catholic. You may not actively participate in Catholicism, but you can be legitimately baptized ONLY a Catholic (welcome home)...seeing that the Catholic church is the true church founded by Christ, on the apostles, you can’t be baptized anything else. You can be baptized in a Lutheran, Methodist, Presbeterian, etc. church, but you are still Baptized Catholic...
Ladies and Gentlemen, Boys and Girls, Dogs and Cats . . .
Here we have YET MORE PROOF of the idolatrous attitudes of the RC's toward Mary.
Proddys are accused of ". . . blaspheming the 'Blessed Virgin . . .'"
Then there's the falsehood that the forum was 'established for the sole purpose of . . . '
I'm beginning to think that they must have some sort of vulcan mind zapping mind-meld lobotomizing something or other in the 'holy' water or maybe the wafers--or maybe in the sound system--some sort of wave-length thing??? Where do they get and how do they distribute such horrific inaccuracies, falsehoods, errors, claptrap?
That they brazenly proffer such horrific falsehoods is outrageous enough.
THAT THEY BELIEVE THEM IS WORSE!
As to honest discourse, Since when has the
Vatican Alice In Wonderland School of Theology and Reality Mangling and all its subunits been the least bit interested in truly honest discourse?
Certainly not since the rubberizing of history for 1600 years and particularly since all the lies about history before 400 AD.
Certainly not since all the UNBIBLICAL fantasies piled on top of microscopic splinters of Scriptural toothpicks rationalizing and justifying dogmatic skyscrapers built on nasty fantasized fumes!
Certainly not since all the horrifically outrageously behaved Popes and now in our era all the ecclesiastical altar boy 'educators, trainers and users' and their protectors in the higher hierarchy.
What a joke--the implication that the RC's are really interested in "honest discourse."
Sheesh.
And they have the audacity to think a drunken gnat should take their hideous theology seriously.
Sigh.
> “Lord,” she replied, “even the dogs under the table eat the children’s crumbs.”
.
Be careful!
Next thing you know they’ll be declaring all dogs to be without sin...
.
>> Let’s stop with this nonsense of tearing the Body of Christ apart.
Excellent characterization.
We are Christians first and foremost.
Bigger battles abound.
>>At the risk of being condemned as a blasphemer, some report seeing Mary’s image on a piece of burnt toast.<<
The appearances I list are heavily researched and are not just images on burnt toast.
Juan Diego, to whom Our Lady Of Guadalupe appeared was beautified a few years ago — after 500+ years of investigation by the RCC. That is a heck of a lot more than a face in some toast. If you do some research, you will see that microscopic messages — readable by electron microscope — were left in the Manta’s eyes: in 1531!
Likewise, the message from Our Lady of Fatima was opened just a few years ago and the Pope has been very quiet on its contents.
Mary has been very active — it is only the spiritually stunted (and bashers) who refuse her love.
The other thread was locked because of flame baiting from all I could see. It didn't start out that way.
And neither did this one.
Rnmom is as entitled to post threads that reflect her beliefs as any FReeper. Simply because Catholics disagree with those beliefs does not by default mean that its flame baiting. Nobody forced anyone to participate on this thread. Everyone came on here of their own free will. It was their choice.
And anyone who wishes can choose to stay off it as well.
“We are Christians first and foremost.
Bigger battles abound.”
BIGGER than we have ever seen before....and it’s time to work together. ;-)))
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