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To: kosta50; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww; count-your-change; ...
Have you ever read the Greek constitution? I doubt it. Nothing in it establishes Eastern Orthodoxy as the "state" religion. Church and state are separate.

Then they have no reason to be arresting anyone for "proselytizing".

The Greeks are among the most religious people in Europe. The number of people who believe in God is equal or higher than in the United States of America. Only Malta and Poland come close.

Big deal. Being *religious* means nothing. Lots of people are *religious* and it doesn't get them anywhere because it's not faith in Christ. It's essentially a vaccine against true faith as people trust in it and feel good about themselves, lulling them into a false sense of security by causing them to think they're actually doing something productive in regard to their afterlife.

Orthodoxy is deeply intertwined with Greek culture, so that much of folklore also has Orthodoxy in it. The two are inseparable, as Judaism is inseparable from Israel.

Let me see now. Greek is the most highly *religious* country in Europe with its religious beliefs intertwined with its society, like Judaism, and yet they manage to divorce it completely from politics, but still arrest someone one for *proselytizing*.

Do you seriously expect us to believe that they divorce their religious beliefs which are so intertwined with their culture from their politics.

Give us a break. Not buying it.

As to being arrested for proselytizing, that may very well be true. Protestant Christians have no business in Christian Greece. Your missionaries should go where Christ is unknown.

They did.

Religion notwithstanding.

2 Timothy 3:1-7 But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good, treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power. Avoid such people. For among them are those who creep into households and capture weak women, burdened with sins and led astray by various passions, always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth.

This is the perfect example of what a Catholic influenced country is like in regard to freedom of religion and what a Protestant influenced country like the US is like in regard to freedom of religion.

Predominantly Catholic countries have very little religious freedom. Predominantly Protestant countries do.

6,635 posted on 01/04/2011 9:02:16 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom

WELL PUT.

Been there.

I don’t think it’s divorced either. Our guide didn’t think so either.


6,636 posted on 01/04/2011 9:09:57 AM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: metmom; Kolokotronis; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww
Then they have no reason to be arresting anyone for "proselytizing"

Do you know their laws? Do you know why they are being arrested, (if they are being arrested!)?

Big deal. Being *religious* means nothing. Lots of people are *religious* and it doesn't get them anywhere because it's not faith in Christ

Greeks are 99% Christian.

people trust in it and feel good about themselves, lulling them into a false sense of security by causing them to think they're actually doing something productive in regard to their afterlife

The same can be said about Christians. Have you been to "afterlife"?

Greek [sic] is the most highly *religious* country in Europe with its religious beliefs intertwined with its society, like Judaism, and yet they manage to divorce it completely from politics, but still arrest someone one for *proselytizing*.

Who said they completely divorce it from politics? We don't, why should they? Again, you are saying they are arresting posleyutizers (examples please), but don;t mention on what charges. Israel arrests missionaries too when they break Israeli laws and nobody in the Protestant community says about it.

Again, there is no one to "proselytize" to in Greece. They are 99% Christian. The Protestant missionaries need to go where the population and the culture is not Christian.

2 Timothy 3:1-7 But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy,

Oy, not again! In "last days"? Paul believed Jesus was coming back real soon. Guess what, he was wrong! If he was wrong on that, why should he be right on anything else?

Also, when was there time when people were not lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy?

This is the perfect example of what a Catholic influenced country is like in regard to freedom of religion

LOL! Catholic-influenced? Greece?

and what a Protestant influenced country like the US is like in regard to freedom of religion

Can you show me where in the Greek Constitution it says there is no freedom of religion?

Predominantly Catholic countries have very little religious freedom. Predominantly Protestant countries do

I hope you don't represent an average Protestant. If you did, I think that would be very troubling. Austria is a predominantly Catholic, so is France, Spain, Poland, Italy, Ireland, Malta, etc.

6,639 posted on 01/04/2011 9:38:31 AM PST by kosta50 (God is tired of repenting -- Jeremiah 15:6, KJV)
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To: metmom

Constitutions are easily ignored unless there is strong enforcement.

Some easily checked examples of state religions existing under constitutions that supposedly guaranteed religious freedom:

www.wordiq.com/definition/Proselytizing

“Issues involving proselytism
Since the collapse of the former Soviet Union and the rise of democracy in the Eastern Block, the Russian Orthodox Church has enjoyed a revival. However, it takes exception to what it considers illegitimate proselytizing by the Roman Catholic Church, the Salvation Army, Jehovah’s Witnesses and other religious movements [2] in what it refers to as its canonical territory.
Greece has a long history of conflict, mostly with Jehovah’s Witnesses but also with some Pentecostals over its laws on proselytism. This situation stems from a law passed in the 1930s by the dictator Ioannis Metaxas. A Jehovah’s Witness, Minos Kokkinakis, won the equivalent of US $14,400 in damages from the Greek state after being arrested repeatedly for the ‘offence’ of preaching his faith from door to door. In another case, Larissis vs. Greece, a member of the Pentecostal church also won a case in the European Court of Human Rights.

2. Starks, R & W.S. Bainbridge The future of religion: secularization, revival and cult formation (1985) Berkely/Los Angeles/London: University of California press”

Other groups like Baptists too have come under attack for speaking to others about their beliefs.


6,641 posted on 01/04/2011 10:17:10 AM PST by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: metmom
Predominantly Catholic countries have very little religious freedom. Predominantly Protestant countries do.

Interesting, mm. Thanks.

Catholic/big gov't - accountable/bow to man, his rules, take from one and give to another, affirmative action, not obeying the law of the land. Socialist/fascism/Marxism.

Protestant/conservative - in God we Trust, all men equal, Pro Constitution, Pro Word, accountable to Our Creator/HIS WORD.
6,645 posted on 01/04/2011 12:06:26 PM PST by presently no screen name
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