I also agree that if one talks to a regular Evengelical about his faith in matters of immediate importance to him, -- moral life, etc., -- A Catholic will not find anything to argue about. The Evangelical distinctives: the total depravity of man, the irresistibility of grace, the limited atonement -- are all, to a Catholic mind, some kind of German philosophical voodoo, that is far from the Gospel and makes little sense, but luckily is not something anyone can really practice. And we are very much about practice. So far, no Evengelical Church taught its flock to do bad works, although I think that that three-car-garage-prosperity gospel guy comes close.
The issue is what perfection means, and its attainment.
Yes, it is. See the Church is here as a hand of God. The Catholics do not think they are saved by being nice people anymore that Protestants do. It is by that hand, to which I bow every Sunday, that hand that holds Him and puts Him in my mouth that I am saved. I want that for everybody. So, read the Holy Scripture adn remember Who gave it to you, -- and reach the right conclusion, please.
I went to many Evangleical Churches with my formerly Evangelical wife, and while theologically it looked deeply flawed, and liturgically insignificant, I agree that the Evangelicals as people are a very nice people and often seem to be touched by genuine grace. I also see how a quintessentuially Evangelical experience of misanthropic self-effacing "me, filthy rags", followed by the bolt of lightning proclamation "I have been saved!" -- be transformational.
Well, thanks for the kind words, but it would be wrong to impugn the transformational misanthropic self-effacing "me, filthy rags", followed by the bolt of lightning proclamation "I have been saved!" type conversion, as it is entirely Biblical. “The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit, (Ps. 34:18) and so the misanthropic self-effacing penitent publican went down to his house justified, (Lk. 18:14) versus the religious who supposed he was all set due to his works. “Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips” (Is. 6:5) cried Isaiah the prophet when He saw the Lord Jesus (Is. 6:10; cf. Jn. 12:39-41) in His glory, before his lips were purged. And the Ethiopian eunuch went on his way rejoicing, not at the possibility of being saved but at being redeemed (though faith must continue), and 1Jn 5:13 provides for assurance of possessing eternal life based upon examination of its description of saving faith.
The preaching of the gospel is to effect conviction of sin, righteousness and judgment, (Jn. 16:8) and thus Peter charged the Jews with being culpable for the death of the risen Jesus Christ the righteous, and warned they would be made His footstool, which resulted in their desperate cry, “Men, brethren, what shall we do?” (Acts 2:14-37)
There simply is no Christianity without this deep realization of need, and man must often be made to face the fact that he is a sinner destitute of any merit whereby he may escape his just eternal punishment and gain eternal life with God, and if he wants to be saved from his sins, and wants light over darkness, then must abase himself as a sinner, helpless to save himself, and cast all his faith on the mercy of God in Christ, relying on the Biblical Lord Jesus, the Son of God, to save him by His blood and righteousness.
But what you not find is souls being treated as if they were Christians due to infant baptism and perfunctory professions, which prevail in institutionalized religion of any camp, while Paul was persuaded that a third generation believer (2Tim. 1:4) was such due to his evidential faith, and who as child had known the holy scriptures, which are able to make one wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. (2Tim. 3:15)
I also agree that if one talks to a regular Evengelical about his faith in matters of immediate importance to him, -- moral life, etc., -- A Catholic will not find anything to argue about.
I did not infer they would, as available evidence shows that the typical Catholic is politically and morally less conservative and more liberal.
The Evangelical distinctives: the total depravity of man, the irresistibility of grace, the limited atonement -- are all, to a Catholic mind, some kind of German philosophical voodoo, that is far from the Gospel and makes little sense, but luckily is not something anyone can really practice.
Total depravity of man and limited atonement are not uniformly held; while Calvinism and classic Arminianism both hold to TD, it may vary somewhat in definition. As for limited atonement, that is a minority view within evangelicalism, being restricted to most Calvinists, and in my opinion, it is not warranted. As for the first being “to a Catholic mind some kind of German philosophical voodoo,” that may be the case now, but that man is dead in sins and morally evil and cannot do good except by God's grace has far more Scriptural warrant than teachings such as praying to saints, indulgences and the Treasury of merit, etc. and the assuredly infallible magisterium, with the former depending upon the latter, and which depends upon itself.
And we are very much about practice.
What is meant by“we?” For all its boasting of works, those Rome counts as members come in last or close thereto among denominations as concerns marks of commitment. And while you have constantly misrepresented Protestant as being opposed to works, if there is any group that between the two at issue that is “very much about practice” it more evangelicals.
So far, no Evengelical Church taught its flock to do bad works,.
Broadly speaking, but if such includes things like the practice of using carnal force over people for religious purposes, as in the Inquisitions, some early ones did, but they learned it from Rome.
although I think that that three-car-garage-prosperity gospel guy comes close
This is true, supposing gain is Godliness, as was selling indulgences, while the Roman Catholic church today gets money (not required but expected) to have masses said to alleviate poor souls in her mythical purgatory, while partly funding herself by gambling.
The issue is what perfection means, and its attainment.
Yes, it is. See the Church is here as a hand of God. The Catholics do not think they are saved by being nice people anymore that Protestants do. It is by that hand, to which I bow every Sunday, that hand that holds Him and puts Him in my mouth that I am saved. I want that for everybody. So, read the Holy Scripture adn remember Who gave it to you, -- and reach the right conclusion, please.
So you bow to the church and it puts Jesus in your mouth, and by which you are saved? Holding the church to be a material means of salvation is one thing; holding that taking part in the Lord's supper is necessary to have life in you, which many RC's erroneously suppose Jn. 6:53 means, is another. The way born again believers live by eating Jesus flesh is the same way Jesus lived, as He explained it: “As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.” (Jn. 6:57) “Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.” (Jn. 4:34) “It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life“ (Jn. 6:63) “..It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God." (Mt. 4:4) “Thy words were found, and I did eat them;.” (Jer. 15:16)
As shown here, Only by ignoring John's and the Bible’s use of allegorical language, among other things, can one sustain that kosher apostles knowingly and unquestioning consumed Jesus body and drinking His blood at the last supper. And it was not the Lord's supper which they preached as the means to have life, but believing the gospel of the crucified and risen Lord Jesus Christ.