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To: boatbums; Kolokotronis; stfassisi
God is most definitely said to "hate" IN SCRIPTURE.

That all depends how you interpret what you read in the Bible. And that is determined by a variety of factors, personal preferences, education, language and quality of translation, marignal notes, historical context, etc, have more to do with how we internalize what we see written.

As I said literal (as well as allegorical) reading of the Bible is problematic, even if it appeals to human nature. As Thayer's Lexicon states "Not a few interpreters have attributed" the Greek word miseo (or the Hebrew equivalent ' sane), which is translated as hate, to mean to "love less, to postpone in love or esteem, to slight". Indeed, careful examination of the Bible seems to agree with this assessment.

For example, Genesis 29:30-31 says

This clearly shows that the the word "hate" really means "loved less" because the previous verse doesn;t say he hated Leah, but that he loved Rachel more. Yet, the following verse says that God saw that Leah was "hated."

Likewise, in Deuteronomy 21:15 a man has two wives, one beloved and the other one "hated." Knowing that a man could divorce a woman, it is reasonable to assume that the "hated" one was less favored between the two, and not really hated.

Also, in the case of Esau (Malachi 1:2, Romans 9:13), it is not to be understood that God hated Esau, but that he favored him less, because that is how the word hate is used throughout the Bible.

And, in Luke 14:26 Jesus is really saying unless a man loves him [Jesus] more than his own father and mother, and brothers and sisters, he cannot be his disciple.

John 12:25 states "He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal." Someone who had to struggle all his life probably was not a smug and blissful as some more fortunate ones, but who persevered despite the obstacles put in front of him in his miserable (hateful) life, he will be rewarded with the evrlatsing life.1

We can pretty be sure, again based on biblical stories, that those things God really hated he also destroyed or made sure they were destroyed, which is not the case in any of the above verses.

I think your response clearly demonstrates what I wrote about earlier: the apparent human preference when interpreting the Bible to make the glove fit the hand. The tendency is to conform God to our image of him, to create a God who is acceptable to us, so we can be comfortable with him, so that we can be "his" and he can "ours".

Obviously some need a a loving, gentle and non-demanidng figure; other want an authoritarian despot who makes us feel safe. It seems to reflect more what we need than what is.

3,089 posted on 11/23/2010 11:22:59 PM PST by kosta50 (God is tired of repenting -- Jeremiah 15:6, KJV)
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To: kosta50; annalex
Obviously some need a a loving, gentle and non-demanidng figure; other want an authoritarian despot who makes us feel safe. It seems to reflect more what we need than what is.

Thanks for the reply and, yes, I'm still up. I'm the kind of person who just believes that there is an intelligent God that created us. That this intelligent creator created man with intelligence as well. I also believe that he didn't just create this intelligent creature and take off but desired to communicate with this creation. That he did this in a way that was verifiable - he told certain people things they did not know and those things happened exactly as he said they would. He also performed miraculous deeds - things that were outside of what was normally observed - in order to demonstrate his power over the natural world.

Now, granted those things happened a long time ago, yet the record of it has persisted, which tells me that it is this intelligent creator who sees to it that this information has been preserved. I believe that the Bible is that record. It is also still relevant and timely and the wisdom contained in it is just as true today as when it was first revealed.

Now, to the subject of God's "emotions" as we call them. Obviously, they are not the same as human emotions, but perfect intrinsically. In the KJV the word "hate" is used less than 100 times. And there are really only a few that speak about God's expression of it. Most of the time it speaks of others who hate wrongly. A few times it is hate towards others who hate God and his ways. When I looked at the examples where the word is used about God, I see that, predominately, it is his expression of aversion to behaviors rather than to a creation. If you look at that great verse in Proverbs 6:16 where God is said to hate/detest and find "abominable" seven things. They are all negative behaviors. They are: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a person who stirs up conflict in the community.

Every one of those behaviors are called evil and they result in evil outcomes. God hates all evil. He hates wickedness. We are told in Proverbs 8:13 "The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogance, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.". So we are commanded to also hate and detest those same evil behaviors. We are told repeatedly to hate evil and love good which is what God also does. Since he alone is omniscient, only he can hate perfectly.

It is really not just how you happen to interpret the Bible, it is overwhelmingly present throughout Scripture that God does hate, yet, it is NOT directly a person but the person's actions. It is those actions - and we all are guilty of one or more of those top seven - that separate us from God. Sin is what it is called and sin has a penalty associated with it. God is holy, righteous, and loves justice. His holiness will not even look upon sin. His righteousness will not allow sin in his presence. His justice demands penalty for sin. He says the only penalty his justice will accept is death.

But this is not the only side of God. He is also merciful, slow to anger and abounding in love. In fact, he loved us so much that he took on flesh as a man and paid the sin debt penalty in our place that his justice demanded. You had said before that it seemed unjust that an innocent person would be sacrificed for the guilty and I agreed. But it wasn't just an innocent man - because no man is innocent, all have sinned and fall short of God's perfection. It was God himself who bore our sins and paid the penalty in his own blood. That is the amazingly awesome grace of God. He offers this redemption as a gift and we, by faith, receive it. There aren't two different Gods, one Old Testament and a different one in the New. It's the same one, the only one, and we see that he has not changed at all. I accept him as he says he is, not what I pretend he is and he is pretty wonderful.

3,094 posted on 11/24/2010 12:22:55 AM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to him.)
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To: kosta50
As I said literal (as well as allegorical) reading of the Bible is problematic, even if it appeals to human nature. As Thayer's Lexicon states "Not a few interpreters have attributed" the Greek word miseo (or the Hebrew equivalent ' sane), which is translated as hate, to mean to "love less, to postpone in love or esteem, to slight". Indeed, careful examination of the Bible seems to agree with this assessment.

While the Greek word used can mean to love less, it also can mean to detest...The Hebrew word for hate does not mean to love less...

It's all in the context of what one is reading...

In Gen 29, Jacob did not love Leah less...He didn't love her at all...In fact, outside of sexual release, Jacob had no use for Leah...And you can bet that every time he looked into her eyes, wishing that she was Rachel, there was something there akin to hate...

Only a 'scholar' could mess up the understanding of Jacob's plight with Laban/Rachel/Leah...

3,112 posted on 11/24/2010 10:41:27 AM PST by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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