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To: RnMomof7
I think it is quite easy to determine if an INFALLIBLE teaching came from Christ and not fallible men... is it a directive found in the scriptures
On what do you base this assertion? Did any Christian prior to the Sixteenth Century share the same viewpoint?

How about "church Fathers?" Will that do?

Which Church Father said that infallible teachings are directives found only in the scriptures?

If there are two conflicting interpretations of a scriptural directive, how do you determine which is the infallible one?

1,707 posted on 11/13/2010 5:43:42 PM PST by mas cerveza por favor
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To: mas cerveza por favor
In which (the two Testaments) every word that appertains to God may be required and discussed; and all knowledge may be understood out of them. But if anything remain which the Holy Scripture does not determine, no other third Scripture ought to be received for authorizing any knowledge or doctrine; but that which remains we must commit to the fire, that is, we will reserve it for God. For in this present world God would not have us to know all things. (Orig. in Lev., hom. 5, 9:6)

We know Jesus Christ is God, and we seek to expound the words which are spoken, according to the dignity of the person. Wherefore it is necessary for us to call the Scriptures into testimony; for our meanings and enarrations, without these witnesses, have no credibility. ( ORIGEN (Tractatus 5 in Matt.) 


No man ought, for the confirmation of doctrines, to use books which are not canonized Scriptures. ( ORIGEN Tract. 26 in Matt.)


Whence comes this tradition? Does it descend from the Lord’s authority, or from the commands and epistles of the apostles? For those things are to be done which are there written. ... If it be commanded in the gospels or the epistles and Acts of the Apostles, then let this holy tradition be observed. ( ST. CYPRIAN OF CARTHAGE Ep. 74 ad Pompeium)

The Catholic Christians will neither speak nor endure to hear any thing in religion that is a stranger to Scripture; it being an evil heart of immodesty to speak those things which are not written. ( 
ST. ATHANASIUS OF ALEXANDRIAExhort. ad Monachas)

Not even the least of the divine and holy mysteries of the faith ought to be handed down without the divine Scriptures. Do not simply give faith to me speaking these things to you except you have the proof of what I say from the divine Scriptures. For the security and preservation of our faith are not supported by ingenuity of speech, but by the proofs of the divine Scriptures. (ST. CYRIL OF JERUSALEM Cat. 4)

The early church fathers are clear that the scriptures are the final authority

1,715 posted on 11/13/2010 6:28:20 PM PST by RnMomof7 (Gal 4:16 asks "Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?")
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To: mas cerveza por favor
If there are two conflicting interpretations of a scriptural directive, how do you determine which is the infallible one

There are essentials and non essentials ..the essentials deal with who God is, His attributes, who Christ is and the things necessary for salvation .

In non essential matters agreement is not necessary .

Scripture confirms scripture, it there is a question..usually a study on what God says on that topic, or how a specific word is used in other scriptures will bring clarity

The posters you are talking with are of various religious faiths.. yet in the essentials we have complete agreement ..

1,716 posted on 11/13/2010 6:34:19 PM PST by RnMomof7 (Gal 4:16 asks "Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?")
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