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To: smvoice
Dear smvoice,

A relic is part of the remains of a saint, or something that came into contact with the saint or his remains. There is nothing supernatural implicated in the existence of relics. The thing either is part of the remains of a saint or something that came into contact therewith, or it's not. It's not a supernatural claim at all.

I was in Baltimore recently and visited the Basilica there. They have a nice little museum. In it, there is a kneeler on which the late Pope John Paul II knelt. There's even a photo of him kneeling on the kneeler. The kneeler is a relic because the late pope touched it. There is nothing supernatural to that claim. Should Pope John Paul be someday canonized, the kneeler will be a relic of a canonized saint of the Catholic Church.

That is the only material claim about the relic. Do you deny that it is a relic? Do you need further investigation that it is a relic?

It is entirely possible to believe that a material object is a relic without believing that there is anything supernatural associated with it (although, to deny that supernatural events have been associated with relics in the past is to deny the historicity of the Bible, but that's another story).

“Yes, if I needed absolute PROOF that a miracle had occurred, the first place I would check is the Catholic Church.”

Absolute proof of most anything is available to no one, at least not as we understand the words “absolute proof.” However, persuasive testimony is something that I would seek from the Church, as Jesus gives considerable authority to the Church.

You don't view the Catholic Church as the Church. I do. In this, we differ. You're wrong, and you will find that out someday. But I won't spend any time trying to persuade you otherwise.


sitetest

861 posted on 09/01/2010 9:00:43 AM PDT by sitetest ( If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: sitetest; Amityschild; Brad's Gramma; Captain Beyond; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; ...

Absolute proof of most anything is available to no one, at least not as we understand the words “absolute proof.” However, persuasive testimony is something that I would seek from the Church, as Jesus gives considerable authority to the Church.


INDEED.

There’s not a convincing shred of evidence that the Vatican/RCC existed before 300-400 AD.

And while Christ DID give tons of authority to HIS UNIVERSAL BODY OF ALL BELIEVERS SPREAD ACROSS ALL REMOTELY AUTHENTIC CHRISTIAN GROUPS,

HE CERTAINLY DID

NOT

DO SO TO THE VATICAN STRUCTURE.


890 posted on 09/01/2010 12:09:00 PM PDT by Quix (C THE PLAN of the Bosses: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2519352/posts?page=2#2)
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